CWU appeal : Update : Appeal has been dismissed!

Coinbags · Post by **Coinbags** » 29 Nov 2019, 08:52

Gasman11 wrote:
Woody Guthrie wrote:The danger in misunderstanding this ruling and blaming the wrong people (either members or the 'establishment') is that we fail to learn from our mistakes.

This is not a stitch up or a case of the judiciary closing ranks with big business it is a very basic amateurish mistake by the communications department of the CWU. The law on workplace ballots is very simple, ballot papers are sent to members home addresses where they can vote in secret free from real and perceived influence or intimidation from their peers. Anything that interferes with that process is automatically unlawful.

A first year law student would have known that this strategy was likely to be challenged so the question is was the legal advice the CWU received shockingly bad or did HQ just choose to ignore it?

Who made these decisions and are they still in post free to make more bad choices?

It's our future that's in the hands of what appears to be a bunch of incompetent fools.
Can you please supply evidence of where the CWU encouraged me to open and complete my ballot paper at work whilst being filmed at the same time for social media upload purposes??

Go to CWU Facebook and twitter feeds to see video upon video of members opening their ballot papers, holding their opened ballot papers in the air in the workplace.
CWU uploaded these videos to their accounts.
That is deemed encouragement - surely.
Amateurs.
As prevoiusly stated - heads at CWU should roll.

Post by **POSTMAN** » 29 Nov 2019, 11:48

TrueBlueTerrier wrote:

Post

You only need to look at the above.....argument finished!

k979aaa · Post by **k979aaa** » 30 Nov 2019, 01:58

As we fill out our HYS at work are they just as illegitimate ie null and void just as those who force us to complete them while watching over us!

Acca Dacca · Post by **Acca Dacca** » 30 Nov 2019, 08:45

k979aaa wrote:As we fill out our HYS at work are they just as illegitimate ie null and void just as those who force us to complete them while watching over us!

No because there is no law about them

Post by **SpacePhoenix** » 30 Nov 2019, 09:29

k979aaa wrote:As we fill out our HYS at work are they just as illegitimate ie null and void just as those who force us to complete them while watching over us!

HYS is a waste of time anyway. You don't always get the results back and nothing ever does done

Post by **aiden01** » 30 Nov 2019, 13:39

k979aaa wrote:As we fill out our HYS at work are they just as illegitimate ie null and void just as those who force us to complete them while watching over us!

Nobody can force you to complete them.

Post by **Aquarius** » 30 Nov 2019, 14:29

The CWU have completely and utterly messed this up - not RM.

Whatever you think of the laws - and how draconian anti-union they are - it is the law as it stands today - which the union are well aware of.
The CWU know all this but thought they were smart to boast this and that on social media (no matter how small the number or the zero affect on the result)
The CWU and all of us knew RM would do anything within the law to try and stop any strike.

So what do we get - establishment this,conspiracy that from the CWU - pathetic.
What do we get now - some rubbish letters to shareholders about how hard done they have been - again pathetic.
Wasting time and money appealing instead of re-balloting straight away - but the time and chance has been lost.
Now was the perfect time to put serious pressure on - and yet again the CWU blew it.

Total and utter clowns

Post by **SpacePhoenix** » 30 Nov 2019, 16:10

Had RM not put in for an injunction, is it possible that the government might have because of the general election?

k979aaa · Post by **k979aaa** » 30 Nov 2019, 16:58

SpacePhoenix wrote:Had RM not put in for an injunction, is it possible that the government might have because of the general election?

Private company now just like British Airways!

Seymour Buts · Post by **Seymour Buts** » 30 Nov 2019, 17:09

Woody Guthrie wrote:
Its not a waste of time if you believe like me it was the wrong decision
You can still go on the official CWU twitter feed and see videos of guys collecting ballot papers in the office.

Morally questionable the verdict might have been but legally?
It's pretty much an open and shut case of a union encouraging interfering with a secret ballot.

It was a dumb move which could cost us members jobs, terms and conditions, somebody at HQ should carry the can for it but nobody will, they'll just keep blaming the 'establishment' etc.

Correct. Anybody buying this establishment crap needs to give their head a wobble.

Gasman11 · Post by **Gasman11** » 30 Nov 2019, 18:02

POSTMAN wrote:
TrueBlueTerrier wrote:

Post
You only need to look at the above.....argument finished!

Clear as day that and my apology is winging its way to Mr Guthrie, erm, apologies Mr Guthrie

postslippete · Post by **postslippete** » 30 Nov 2019, 18:21

I agree, I seem to recall Dave ward saying that they didn't think the appeal was going to be successful but that they would appeal anyway. More time wasted then? Blaming the establishment and the Tory party is just sour grapes.

Thing is the dynamics have shifted now. We have got agency guys trained and delivering parcels,doing delivery work and there are even agency guys coming in later putting York's away!! Royal Mail now have a small reserve workforce though it must be costing them a fair whack. It's probably why they are all working 20 hours or less a week. They don't know when or indeed where they are going to be working until last minute.

Rico clearly seems to be a bit of a hard man to bargain with. He talks about having negotiations with the CWU without preconditions - but the question of how Royal Mail have got billions to spend on parcel hubs whilst it cannot afford the SWW still goes unanswered. Royal Mail are also not answering the question of redundancies/job losses in the future as regards parcel automation and for changes in delivery. All they are saying is that there will be jobs for the people that want it and that we will still have best terms and conditions. No wonder the talks are still in stalemate.

k979aaa · Post by **k979aaa** » 30 Nov 2019, 21:34

postslippete wrote:I agree, I seem to recall Dave ward saying that they didn't think the appeal was going to be successful but that they would appeal anyway. More time wasted then? Blaming the establishment and the Tory party is just sour grapes.

Thing is the dynamics have shifted now. We have got agency guys trained and delivering parcels,doing delivery work and there are even agency guys coming in later putting York's away!! Royal Mail now have a small reserve workforce though it must be costing them a fair whack. It's probably why they are all working 20 hours or less a week. They don't know when or indeed where they are going to be working until last minute.

Rico clearly seems to be a bit of a hard man to bargain with. He talks about having negotiations with the CWU without preconditions - but the question of how Royal Mail have got billions to spend on parcel hubs whilst it cannot afford the SWW still goes unanswered. Royal Mail are also not answering the question of redundancies/job losses in the future as regards parcel automation and for changes in delivery. All they are saying is that there will be jobs for the people that want it and that we will still have best terms and conditions. No wonder the talks are still in stalemate.

Because we expendable in his mind, Look at the clowns they have employed who cannot do the job or any job but is the same at the top he is a belligerent bastard from Hamburg who nobody wanted to know his rise to the top is built on work practice of two century's before us all. For this guy tells us one thing and does another just llike Donald Trump, Boris Johnson and not forgetting Tony Blair they are the same. Capitalism has run it's course with failed hospitals railways bus services and airports and Royal Mail and not least we don't control the means of production of energy in this land anymore. When I went to school we were gave Milk and school dinners now the children of our nation are told to find food banks!

yellowbelly · Post by **yellowbelly** » 01 Dec 2019, 14:29

postslippete wrote:............Royal Mail now have a small reserve workforce though it must be costing them a fair whack. ....

There's probably a ring fenced budget for exactly this scenario. Don't forget that RM will probably save on ongoing costs on these people that they
would have with RM employed posties ie uniform, holiday pay, sick pay, delivery supplement, employer pension contributions, they probably
don't get paid (in time or fuel expenses) to travel to different offices, Xmas stamps (whoopee!!), Xmas bonuses, do they get paid breaks?.....

Post by **Sugar** » 02 Dec 2019, 17:10

[quote="postslippete"All they are saying is that there will be jobs for the people that want it and that we will still have best terms and conditions. [/quote]

TUPE