NRA 60 pension not claimed at the time

[MichaelH]

I'm approaching 63, and have been a postie for 17 years. I currently expect to retire at 65.

I recently discovered that I've apparently been entitled to claim NRA 60 pension benefits (around £3500 pa) since I was 60. I've now completed the relevant paperwork and expect to receive monthly payments as from next month (July 2015).

Can I retrospectively claim the past benefits? If not, it seems to me that I've effectively been robbed of over £10,000. As far as I'm aware, the fact that I have "accidentally deferred" my entitlement hasn't increased my future benefits.

As a supplementary question - why would anyone not wish to claim NRA 60 benefits as soon as possible? (Apart from people like me who simply didn't realize at the time that they could, obviously.)

[heapsy]

I'm approaching 63, and have been a postie for 17 years. I currently expect to retire at 65.

I recently discovered that I've apparently been entitled to claim NRA 60 pension benefits (around £3500 pa) since I was 60. I've now completed the relevant paperwork and expect to receive monthly payments as from next month (July 2015).

Can I retrospectively claim the past benefits? If not, it seems to me that I've effectively been robbed of over £10,000. As far as I'm aware, the fact that I have "accidentally deferred" my entitlement hasn't increased my future benefits.

As a supplementary question - why would anyone not wish to claim NRA 60 benefits as soon as possible? (Apart from people like me who simply didn't realize at the time that they could, obviously.)

Simple answer is no. Also, as you are a section C member, joined AFTER 31st March 1987 you are entitled to a supplement which you DO NOT get while you are still working for the business.
As for not realising you could claim the pension, it has been well documented and publicised for a while now but people haven't bothered reading the pension statements. Had someone from our office did exactly the same, he only knew when he was about 63 and I happened to mention something to him.

[baldrick]

Unfortunately no. You would have got a letter from the pensions section about 3 months before your 60th birthday asking if you wanted to take your pension at 60.

[RobertT]

The optimum age to claim your pension is at the relevant Normal Retirement Age, so in the case of the RMPP that’s 60 and 65. It is possible to take your pension any time after 55 but because of the reductions applied(5% per year), it generally isn’t the best thing to do. Equally there is no benefit from deferring after normal retirement age because there is no enhancement for doing so.

Although if you should want to defer your state pension when the time comes, that would be beneficial. Although from April 2016 when the 'new state pension' is introduced it won't be as beneficial as it is now. Should you be interested then here's a couple of links:

https://www.gov.uk/deferring-state-pens ... ou-may-get" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
https://www.gov.uk/new-state-pension/eligibility" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

[N1-22postman]

Re: Pension advice needed regards EVR

Postby N1-22postman » Sun Jun 21, 2015 11:46 am
For many older postmen with a lot of service before 1st April 2010 (this is the cut off date when the NRA retirement date changed from 60 to 65) there is no advantage to not taking your NRA60 pension benefits at the age of 60. You can take your NRA60 pension and still carry on working after 60. The Royal Mail pension service told me that there would be no enhancement other than an annual increase in line with pension increase (review) orders issued by the government (based I think on RPI in September). This has been around 2% or 3% for the last few years. This is a very bad deal - compare it to not taking the state pension at 65 where the government enhance this by 10.4% for each year you do not take it.
Have I got this right? I am now 64 and have had 4 years NRA60 annual pension of roughly £36K gross (it started below £9k in 2011 and has increased (in line with RPI) to over £9k in 2015). If I had not taken my NRA60 pension at age 60 and taken my NRA60 pension at 64, I would have lost this £36K gross and started an annual pension of roughly the same amount as I receive now. This doesn`t seem right or fair?
This is my post a couple of weeks ago - see "Pension advice needed regards evr" posted by jcjd on 15th June. Our union, for which we pay a sizeable amount of money in subs, should contact people approaching 60 warning of the huge losses they could make by not taking NRA60 benefits at 60 whilst still carry on working in the job. Royal Mail are complicit in this scandal by not automatically paying NRA60 benefits at 60 (and making it an option not to take these benefits) instead of, as at present, making it an option of taking it and if you do nothing you loose it . Many older postmen believe that you take a pension when you retire (65 is the default retirement age at present) and think you cannot be receiving a pension while still working. There must be postmen who have lost £50K because of this.

[RobertT]

Re: Pension advice needed regards EVR

Postby N1-22postman » Sun Jun 21, 2015 11:46 am
For many older postmen with a lot of service before 1st April 2010 (this is the cut off date when the NRA retirement date changed from 60 to 65) there is no advantage to not taking your NRA60 pension benefits at the age of 60. You can take your NRA60 pension and still carry on working after 60. The Royal Mail pension service told me that there would be no enhancement other than an annual increase in line with pension increase (review) orders issued by the government (based I think on RPI in September). This has been around 2% or 3% for the last few years. This is a very bad deal - compare it to not taking the state pension at 65 where the government enhance this by 10.4% for each year you do not take it.
Have I got this right? I am now 64 and have had 4 years NRA60 annual pension of roughly £36K gross (it started below £9k in 2011 and has increased (in line with RPI) to over £9k in 2015). If I had not taken my NRA60 pension at age 60 and taken my NRA60 pension at 64, I would have lost this £36K gross and started an annual pension of roughly the same amount as I receive now. This doesn`t seem right or fair?
This is my post a couple of weeks ago - see "Pension advice needed regards evr" posted by jcjd on 15th June. Our union, for which we pay a sizeable amount of money in subs, should contact people approaching 60 warning of the huge losses they could make by not taking NRA60 benefits at 60 whilst still carry on working in the job. Royal Mail are complicit in this scandal by not automatically paying NRA60 benefits at 60 (and making it an option not to take these benefits) instead of, as at present, making it an option of taking it and if you do nothing you loose it . Many older postmen believe that you take a pension when you retire (65 is the default retirement age at present) and think you cannot be receiving a pension while still working. There must be postmen who have lost £50K because of this.

I agree there is a lot of people who don’t know what their entitled to and when. However the RMPP do send out ‘plan guides’ to members every few years and they are also online for you to download, so the information is out there. The biggest problem, in my opinion is that many people don’t read or don’t understand what’s at their disposal.

There is no ‘default retirement age’ - that was abolished in April 2011, so your pension won’t automatically be paid out at 65 either. People now have the right to retire whenever they want to, assuming finances allow.

[Surreypostie]

Re: Pension advice needed regards EVR

Postby N1-22postman » Sun Jun 21, 2015 11:46 am
For many older postmen with a lot of service before 1st April 2010 (this is the cut off date when the NRA retirement date changed from 60 to 65) there is no advantage to not taking your NRA60 pension benefits at the age of 60. You can take your NRA60 pension and still carry on working after 60. The Royal Mail pension service told me that there would be no enhancement other than an annual increase in line with pension increase (review) orders issued by the government (based I think on RPI in September). This has been around 2% or 3% for the last few years. This is a very bad deal - compare it to not taking the state pension at 65 where the government enhance this by 10.4% for each year you do not take it.
Have I got this right? I am now 64 and have had 4 years NRA60 annual pension of roughly £36K gross (it started below £9k in 2011 and has increased (in line with RPI) to over £9k in 2015). If I had not taken my NRA60 pension at age 60 and taken my NRA60 pension at 64, I would have lost this £36K gross and started an annual pension of roughly the same amount as I receive now. This doesn`t seem right or fair?
This is my post a couple of weeks ago - see "Pension advice needed regards evr" posted by jcjd on 15th June. Our union, for which we pay a sizeable amount of money in subs, should contact people approaching 60 warning of the huge losses they could make by not taking NRA60 benefits at 60 whilst still carry on working in the job. Royal Mail are complicit in this scandal by not automatically paying NRA60 benefits at 60 (and making it an option not to take these benefits) instead of, as at present, making it an option of taking it and if you do nothing you loose it . Many older postmen believe that you take a pension when you retire (65 is the default retirement age at present) and think you cannot be receiving a pension while still working. There must be postmen who have lost £50K because of this.

I agree there is a lot of people who don’t know what their entitled to and when. However the RMPP do send out ‘plan guides’ to members every few years and they are also online for you to download, so the information is out there. The biggest problem, in my opinion is that many people don’t read or don’t understand what’s at their disposal.

There is no ‘default retirement age’ - that was abolished in April 2011, so your pension won’t automatically be paid out at 65 either. People now have the right to retire whenever they want to, assuming finances allow.

Yes, I remember David Cameron making a speech. If you cannot afford to retire, don't. I should think the only people who will be able to afford to retire will be people who own their homes and are mortgage free. I am a renter, many people I know are renters, those who have to pay rent in the private sector, in excess of £1200 a month will never have a pension big enough to cover that, let alone anything else.

[arnold cheshire]

Re: Pension advice needed regards EVR

Postby N1-22postman » Sun Jun 21, 2015 11:46 am
For many older postmen with a lot of service before 1st April 2010 (this is the cut off date when the NRA retirement date changed from 60 to 65) there is no advantage to not taking your NRA60 pension benefits at the age of 60. You can take your NRA60 pension and still carry on working after 60. The Royal Mail pension service told me that there would be no enhancement other than an annual increase in line with pension increase (review) orders issued by the government (based I think on RPI in September). This has been around 2% or 3% for the last few years. This is a very bad deal - compare it to not taking the state pension at 65 where the government enhance this by 10.4% for each year you do not take it.
Have I got this right? I am now 64 and have had 4 years NRA60 annual pension of roughly £36K gross (it started below £9k in 2011 and has increased (in line with RPI) to over £9k in 2015). If I had not taken my NRA60 pension at age 60 and taken my NRA60 pension at 64, I would have lost this £36K gross and started an annual pension of roughly the same amount as I receive now. This doesn`t seem right or fair?
This is my post a couple of weeks ago - see "Pension advice needed regards evr" posted by jcjd on 15th June. Our union, for which we pay a sizeable amount of money in subs, should contact people approaching 60 warning of the huge losses they could make by not taking NRA60 benefits at 60 whilst still carry on working in the job. Royal Mail are complicit in this scandal by not automatically paying NRA60 benefits at 60 (and making it an option not to take these benefits) instead of, as at present, making it an option of taking it and if you do nothing you loose it . Many older postmen believe that you take a pension when you retire (65 is the default retirement age at present) and think you cannot be receiving a pension while still working. There must be postmen who have lost £50K because of this.

I agree there is a lot of people who don’t know what their entitled to and when. However the RMPP do send out ‘plan guides’ to members every few years and they are also online for you to download, so the information is out there. The biggest problem, in my opinion is that many people don’t read or don’t understand what’s at their disposal.

There is no ‘default retirement age’ - that was abolished in April 2011, so your pension won’t automatically be paid out at 65 either. People now have the right to retire whenever they want to, assuming finances allow.

Yes, I remember David Cameron making a speech. If you cannot afford to retire, don't. I should think the only people who will be able to afford to retire will be people who own their homes and are mortgage free. I am a renter, many people I know are renters, those who have to pay rent in the private sector, in excess of £1200 a month will never have a pension big enough to cover that, let alone anything else.

how could a postie afford £1200 a month just for rent working anyway unless your wifes a GP ?

[baldrick]

I think many opgs believe that if they take their RM pension they have to retire, ie leave RM. That is the case in most jobs I believe.
So some opgs don't take the pension at 60 as they don't think they can live on just the RM pension, especially if they don't have many years service.
They don't understand that they can take their pension and continue working, so they would be better off.

[heapsy]

When I started 20+ years back you could not take your pension and carry on working for the company. This was an inland revenue rule which has only changed in the last few years.The older guys who were in section B of the pension used to leave at 60 and take their pension with the maximum 25% lump sum.They then took a job somewhere and worked until 65. If they carried on working at RM they would have carried on building up a pension but would have had LESS years to draw it. That was the thinking back then, and tbh they had a point. Many people didn't live for 15 to 20 or even more years after retirement in those days. The state pension age was set as it was, 65 years because you were likely to live until about 66. 68 if you were a doctor, due to better living conditions, food, education etc. Strangely many of them are now in their 80s and doing ok. My advice would be to build up AVCs and other assets and take them at 60 with the NRA60, including your supplement. In my case this could be about £3,000 p.a.This is payable until STATE pension age, NOT 65. I intend to leave my NRA65 pension until 65 and maybe take a part time job, and also use savings and investments including something, which I don't know what it will be, left by my parents. If you are in delivery you really have to ask yourself if you would be able to work until 65? Probably not.

[RobertT]

Previously the default retirement age in RM was 60, although you could ask to stay on after that if you wanted to – at my place that was known as being ‘on retention’. But you could not access your pension and you had to then go at 65 regardless.

Then the default retirement age was raised to 65, and if you wanted to take your pension at 60 and leave, you had to claim it rather than it being paid out automatically. And in 2011 rules were changed across the board to allow ‘flexible retirement’ and the compulsion to retire at a set age was removed. Now if you want to retire, it's a case of resigning and taking your pension.

The advice given by heapsy about AVC’s/investments and taking your pensions at the correct ages is good and is similar to what I’m doing myself. Although the only word of caution I would add, is don’t rely on getting anything from a legacy. There’s no guarantee of when you are likely to receive it or even if you’re likely to get it at all, because the longer your relatives live the more likely they are to need it for themselves to pay for care costs, etc.

[heapsy]

Previously the default retirement age in RM was 60, although you could ask to stay on after that if you wanted to – at my place that was known as being ‘on retention’. But you could not access your pension and you had to then go at 65 regardless.

Then the default retirement age was raised to 65, and if you wanted to take your pension at 60 and leave, you had to claim it rather than it being paid out automatically. And in 2011 rules were changed across the board to allow ‘flexible retirement’ and the compulsion to retire at a set age was removed. Now if you want to retire, it's a case of resigning and taking your pension.

The advice given by heapsy about AVC’s/investments and taking your pensions at the correct ages is good and is similar to what I’m doing myself. Although the only word of caution I would add, is don’t rely on getting anything from a legacy. There’s no guarantee of when you are likely to receive it or even if you’re likely to get it at all, because the longer your relatives live the more likely they are to need it for themselves to pay for care costs, etc.

Yes Robert you are spot on regarding the legacy. I have no idea what or when. I have shares and ISAs and a couple of other pensions which I hope will provide some diversity AND flexibility as to when I can retire. The real problem as you will be aware is that the goal posts are being moved constantly which is why I am doing as I am. Just hope a few on here pick up one or two ideas along the way.

[RobertT]

Yes, the goalposts are being moved far too often. Pensions can be hard enough to understand at the best of times without all the tinkering that’s been going on in the last few years and George Osbourne announced in the budget that there could be more changes to come.

It’s always good to have a few different irons in the fire and it’s important to realise that there’s more to retirement saving than just having a pension, particularly if you want to retire fairly early. The important thing is to be proactive and save from an early age, which many people don’t and then they seem to end up making poor decisions later in life. Pensions are like marathons – you have to slowly build them up over your working life. The trouble is that many people don’t and then want to make a mad sprint for the line when they haven’t put the hard work in.

Personally I first took an interest in my retirement in my mid 20’s. I decided then that 60 was the latest I wanted to work until and I knew the RM pension on its own wouldn’t be enough. At first it was just a distant dream but twenty years and some fairly serious saving later and I’m well on track to achieving that aim.

The way I see things is that I’m slowly getting older and my savings/investments are slowly increasing, so as time goes by I have more money to last me less time. At some point I will have enough to retire.

[heapsy]

I think many opgs believe that if they take their RM pension they have to retire, ie leave RM. That is the case in most jobs I believe.
So some opgs don't take the pension at 60 as they don't think they can live on just the RM pension, especially if they don't have many years service.
They don't understand that they can take their pension and continue working, so they would be better off.

Having the wrong information is a serious problem. A colleague of mine who joined only a few months earlier than me has made a big mistake. We are both section C members. He took his NRA 60 pension at 60 and is continuing to work until 65, so has lost his supplement. However here is the crunch. He wrongly believed for some reason that you were taxed TWICE. That is to say taxed on your earnings that you put into a pension, then taxed when you drew your pension. For some reason he had no idea about tax relief. He therefore decided NOT to join the NRA 65 pension. . He really does have his head in the sand. When he was approaching sixty I told he we would go for a pint or two and would give him a few pointers. He never got back to me. His wife told me that he cannot talk about money issues, even with her. Tbh the union could and should do more. The problem is that they probably see it as getting caught giving bad advice and think they will be liable in some way. They therefore decide not to offer anything which is proving a costly error. This whole issue is compounded by the " you don't talk about religion, politics or money down the pub" attitude that prevails in this country which means you don't find out from your mates that you have other options. You comment regarding people wrongly thinking you have to retire if you take your pension is precisely the same issue. People are just not getting the message and we are one of the worst countries for saving and investing. A disaster waiting to happen me thinks.

[Surreypostie]

Re: Pension advice needed regards EVR

Postby N1-22postman » Sun Jun 21, 2015 11:46 am
For many older postmen with a lot of service before 1st April 2010 (this is the cut off date when the NRA retirement date changed from 60 to 65) there is no advantage to not taking your NRA60 pension benefits at the age of 60. You can take your NRA60 pension and still carry on working after 60. The Royal Mail pension service told me that there would be no enhancement other than an annual increase in line with pension increase (review) orders issued by the government (based I think on RPI in September). This has been around 2% or 3% for the last few years. This is a very bad deal - compare it to not taking the state pension at 65 where the government enhance this by 10.4% for each year you do not take it.
Have I got this right? I am now 64 and have had 4 years NRA60 annual pension of roughly £36K gross (it started below £9k in 2011 and has increased (in line with RPI) to over £9k in 2015). If I had not taken my NRA60 pension at age 60 and taken my NRA60 pension at 64, I would have lost this £36K gross and started an annual pension of roughly the same amount as I receive now. This doesn`t seem right or fair?
This is my post a couple of weeks ago - see "Pension advice needed regards evr" posted by jcjd on 15th June. Our union, for which we pay a sizeable amount of money in subs, should contact people approaching 60 warning of the huge losses they could make by not taking NRA60 benefits at 60 whilst still carry on working in the job. Royal Mail are complicit in this scandal by not automatically paying NRA60 benefits at 60 (and making it an option not to take these benefits) instead of, as at present, making it an option of taking it and if you do nothing you loose it . Many older postmen believe that you take a pension when you retire (65 is the default retirement age at present) and think you cannot be receiving a pension while still working. There must be postmen who have lost £50K because of this.

I agree there is a lot of people who don’t know what their entitled to and when. However the RMPP do send out ‘plan guides’ to members every few years and they are also online for you to download, so the information is out there. The biggest problem, in my opinion is that many people don’t read or don’t understand what’s at their disposal.

There is no ‘default retirement age’ - that was abolished in April 2011, so your pension won’t automatically be paid out at 65 either. People now have the right to retire whenever they want to, assuming finances allow.

Yes, I remember David Cameron making a speech. If you cannot afford to retire, don't. I should think the only people who will be able to afford to retire will be people who own their homes and are mortgage free. I am a renter, many people I know are renters, those who have to pay rent in the private sector, in excess of £1200 a month will never have a pension big enough to cover that, let alone anything else.

how could a postie afford £1200 a month just for rent working anyway unless your wifes a GP ?

In work benefits. Housing benefit to name just one. Rents in my area can be anything upto £3000 a month.