Employee Ownership

[pcb]

With privatisation around the corner is it not time for this Union to seriously think about employee Ownership. If shares are offered would it not be prudent to consolidate the shares and have a genuine voice about the way forward. The german union IG METALL has stated that The best shareholders are the employees.

[Red Robbo]

With privatisation around the corner is it not time for this Union to seriously think about employee Ownership. If shares are offered would it not be prudent to consolidate the shares and have a genuine voice about the way forward. The german union IG METALL has stated that The best shareholders are the employees.

I agree, we should have Billy as Chairman, Dave as CEO and the rest of the executive as the board, then the Annual Conference in Bournemouth could be changed to a shareholders meeting.

[borders]

With privatisation around the corner is it not time for this Union to seriously think about employee Ownership. If shares are offered would it not be prudent to consolidate the shares and have a genuine voice about the way forward. The german union IG METALL has stated that The best shareholders are the employees.

surely this will be just a token gesture and will not mean the union or the employees have a real genuine voice in the running of the company ? once privatised and it now looks likely, the employees will be bought off with a few quid and the main aim of any private company is to make a profit. this business is labour intensive and it doesnt take the brain of britain to see where the cuts and savings will come from.

[pcb]

I think you have missed the point, we are going to be privatised period! No matter what. So what to do after the fact, do we stand outside and gradually lose all influence or do we use the tools available to keep influence ( Industrial action plus shareholders voting rights). At present we are just wandering blindly toward the abyss.

[borders]

I think you have missed the point, we are going to be privatised period! No matter what. So what to do after the fact, do we stand outside and gradually lose all influence or do we use the tools available to keep influence ( Industrial action plus shareholders voting rights). At present we are just wandering blindly toward the abyss.

The Communication Workers Union (CWU), representing postal workers, repeated its long standing view that the willingness of the government to take on Royal Mail's pension liabilities was a great success.

"We've been campaigning for this for years," a spokesman told the BBC.

"When we first suggested it, we were laughed at. It's important that pensions are protected."

However, the CWU remains opposed to privatisation of the postal service itself.

"It's not in interests of the public, customers or postal workers," the spokesman said.

"Why nationalise the debt and privatise the profits?"


as far as i am aware ,as quoted above the CWU is still against privatisation. so maybe the CWU needs to decide and maybe canvas whether it/ the employees are up for this ? the CWU has always been against privatisation?
would there be any guarantees from the new bosses , that the CWU would have any influence ? lip service and marginalised i reckon....

[pcb]

Again missed the point, privatisation will happen no matter what. We had our opportunity back in 2006/7/8/9/10 and we lost the argument with the public. I should know having attended many anti privatisation marches and rallys and most of them hardly had any large amounts of the public attending them!
Reality is that we must have a properly thought out strategy that is forward thinking and ensures that the union is in the room when future decisions are made.

[fishtank]

Reality is that we must have a properly thought out strategy that is forward thinking and ensures that the union is in the room when future decisions are made.

I thought it was Employee Ownership you were talking about not Union Ownership.
It's a dangerous game allocating an ownership say or voting right to the workforce and then assuming that the union can legally speak for them.
It's not the same as collective bargaining rights.
It's a bit of a legal minefield to be honest.

[pcb]

The German unions have been doing this for the last 20 years.

[fishtank]

The German unions have been doing this for the last 20 years.

I think it will depend what shape the employee ownership takes.
Will Royal Mail staff,members and non-members accept a 10% stake in the company that isn't individually transferable and has no real monetary value other than an annual bonus/dividend?
That's the only way that voting rights would work so that the 10% stake was not diluted.

[Martin Walsh]

There are four types of privitastion being discussed by the Government. These are :

1. Bought by an equity firm to be broken up. ( This is the least desired way and least likely. )
2. Joint Venture ( Again not likely due to the amount of money and opposed by Royal Mail )
3. A sell off along the lines of British Telecom and British Gas where the Government still hold the majority share for now and the Royal Mail board continues to be in charge of Royal Mail. This is the most likely.
4. Is a management buy out. The company has been valued at 1.4 billion and clearly the senior mangement could borrow this money especially given the chairmans links to the city.

In any of these options there is a committment to a percentage of employee owenership shares which cannot be sold outside of the company.

Now just because the Postal Act is law does not mean that privitisation is definaltely going to happen. The Government has said that the market is not yet ready to privitiase this year and who knows what the politcal landscape will be next year as they say a day is a long time in politics.

Now the union made the right move in supporting state aid , but it is still the right tactic to oppose privitisation but still be talking to both the government and Royal Mail and influencing the debate.

[borders]

Dingo, in laymans terms can you paint a picture of what a sell off may look like and what its effects may be ?
its good to see the Union will oppose this Privatisation , but after the initial lobbying of the MPs etc , what would be the next likely tactic if any , if the lobbying was unsuccessful ?

[fishtank]

Now just because the Postal Act is law does not mean that privitisation is definaltely going to happen.

Surely with the pension transfer already going ahead the pressure on Government to sell the business will increase as until RMPP can be closed and a private occupational scheme opened the liabilities will continue to grow and the amount the Government will have to leave in to cover these liabilities will also grow downgrading their ability to reduce borrowing.
I believe as of April fool's day...the clock is ticking.

[Martin Walsh]

I think your find that the pension fund back service and furture service and funding have now been agreed going forward.

The details no doubt will be coming out soon.