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concerned wrote:Luddite
Just so you know, my postmand is an ex investment banker. He took early retirement and started working for RM and says its probably the hardest job he has done. But he finds interacting with the public is a reward and also likes the hours. But im guessing the fact he was an Investment Banker all his life until his 50s now means he's unskilled - oui?
PRAT
Once again you miss the point, it's the JOB that's unskilled not the workers
Ok yes.....unskilled but requires physical energy and alot of devototion....as an employer i know what i would prefer
Carpentry is no longer seen as skilled by the way, it is called a TRADE duh
oh and another thing Luddite....i have customers from all walks of life as my business is based in a very wealthy area. What i have realised is the vast majority of the middle class and upwards are totally understanding this dispute and support the staff. While the lower 'middle' (or think they are) / upper working class are more like you. Bit like the newspapers really - The Sun are putting them down whereas intelligent reading like the Guardian or The Times or The Independant are showing more what it is about and showing empathy for the staff. Kinda says it all really. So as a tradesperson you fit into the working class wanting to be middle class bracket which shows in your opinion
I always thought that the definition of skilled or unskilled job is a little outdated.
All jobs have skills its just that some require formal qualifications and some don't. However qualifications give no insight apart from a basic overview, of the skills required to carry out a job successfully.
Anyone can put pieces of paper through a hole in a door just like anyone can hammer two planks of wood together. To gauge either job on just those statements would be ludicrous, pointless and divisive. We will always need someone to deliver letters and packets, we will also always need carpenters and tradesmen, what the point of one worker thinking they are better than another just because they have qualifications.
I have been a Personal Assistant, a chauffeur, a pay clerk, an LGV driver, a FLT operator, a dangerous goods certificated (well about 8 of them) driver, a serviceman, an accounts clerk, a call centre operative. Some of those jobs are so called skilled, some are unskilled, but all of them required skills I was not aware of before I started them. So sorry I cant see why some people think an unskilled job is somehow not as good, or not as important as a "skilled" job.
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TrueBlueTerrier wrote:I always thought that the definition of skilled or unskilled job is a little outdated.
All jobs have skills its just that some require formal qualifications and some don't. However qualifications give no insight apart from a basic overview, of the skills required to carry out a job successfully.
Anyone can put pieces of paper through a hole in a door just like anyone can hammer two planks of wood together. To gauge either job on just those statements would be ludicrous, pointless and divisive. We will always need someone to deliver letters and packets, we will also always need carpenters and tradesmen, what the point of one worker thinking they are better than another just because they have qualifications.
I have been a Personal Assistant, a chauffeur, a pay clerk, an LGV driver, a FLT operator, a dangerous goods certificated (well about 8 of them) driver, a serviceman, an accounts clerk, a call centre operative. Some of those jobs are so called skilled, some are unskilled, but all of them required skills I was not aware of before I started them. So sorry I cant see why some people think an unskilled job is somehow not as good, or not as important as a "skilled" job.
Lots of nit picking going on now, which I can't be assed to answer.
But I would say "Not good" or "important" do not come into it.
It is fact that less skilled jobs generally pay less than more skilled jobs, even the most blinkerd of you must conceed that!
concerned wrote:Luddite
Just so you know, my postmand is an ex investment banker. He took early retirement and started working for RM and says its probably the hardest job he has done. But he finds interacting with the public is a reward and also likes the hours. But im guessing the fact he was an Investment Banker all his life until his 50s now means he's unskilled - oui?
PRAT
Once again you miss the point, it's the JOB that's unskilled not the workers
you clearly didnt read
we are required to posses a full driving licence.isnt driving a skill?
if we loose it,we face the sack....now i expect skilled wages for that alone
please go back to my previous post and remove your chip from thy shoulder.
i know your a skilled wood screwer but even you could absorbe the information if you read it enough
concerned wrote:Luddite
Just so you know, my postmand is an ex investment banker. He took early retirement and started working for RM and says its probably the hardest job he has done. But he finds interacting with the public is a reward and also likes the hours. But im guessing the fact he was an Investment Banker all his life until his 50s now means he's unskilled - oui?
PRAT
Once again you miss the point, it's the JOB that's unskilled not the workers
you clearly didnt read
we are required to posses a full driving licence.isnt driving a skill?
if we loose it,we face the sack....now i expect skilled wages for that alone
please go back to my previous post and remove your chip from thy shoulder.
i know your a skilled wood screwer but even you could absorbe the information if you read it enough
I am sorry I I should have said LESS SKILLED,
By your reasoning, walking, talking, etc are all skills that postmen (as well as most of the population) have also managed to master.
I'm sure what you are paid, takes account of the multitude of skills that are required to be a postman, including being able to drive.
Even you will I'm sure realise, there are degrees of skill, take your unions negotiators for example, they seem to be severerly lacking on the skills front, sold down the river is the only phrase that comes to mind!
concerned wrote:Luddite
Just so you know, my postmand is an ex investment banker. He took early retirement and started working for RM and says its probably the hardest job he has done. But he finds interacting with the public is a reward and also likes the hours. But im guessing the fact he was an Investment Banker all his life until his 50s now means he's unskilled - oui?
PRAT
Once again you miss the point, it's the JOB that's unskilled not the workers
you clearly didnt read
we are required to posses a full driving licence.isnt driving a skill?
if we loose it,we face the sack....now i expect skilled wages for that alone
please go back to my previous post and remove your chip from thy shoulder.
i know your a skilled wood screwer but even you could absorbe the information if you read it enough
I am sorry I I should have said LESS SKILLED,
By your reasoning, walking, talking, etc are all skills that postmen (as well as most of the population) have also managed to master.
I'm sure what you are paid, takes account of the multitude of skills that are required to be a postman, including being able to drive.
Even you will I'm sure realise, there are degrees of skill, take your unions negotiators for example, they seem to be severerly lacking on the skills front, sold down the river is the only phrase that comes to mind!
it doesnt matter that most people can drive,it matter that if you become unable you loose your job.#
as for sailing..well cant fooking argue with that
I see no peacfull future for the RM, when I read the posts on the various boards.
Obviously none of you are happy that the union seems to have folded and sent you back to work with no positive result.
When one of your members (peejay 14) does speak out in favour of the changes he is slagged off big time.
It seems virtually none of you have any intention of trying to make the changes work.
You need to get your heads round the fact that the RM will change the way you work, even the CWU can't stop that, which is why you are back at work today.
I may be wrong, but reading some boards, it seems some of your offices have implemented the changes and are making it work.
If it works for some why not all, is the management better in some offices than in others, or are some offices just more militant than others?
I'm sure there are a huge number of posties who just want to get on with their job and do not give two hoots how it changes.
I think you should be pressing for no compulsory redundancies, and no compulsory reduction in hours from full to part time, and acept that the way you work may change, what's it matter as long as you have a job and are paid for your 40 hours?
Last edited by luddite123 on 06 Nov 2009, 21:41, edited 1 time in total.
luddite wrote:I see no peacfull future for the RM, when I read the posts on the various boards.
Obviously none of you are happy that the union seems to have folded and sent you back to work with no positive result.
When one of your members (peejay 14) does speak out in favour of the changes he is slagged off big time.
It seems vertually none of you have any intention of trying to make the changes work.
You need to get your heads round the fact that the RM will change the way you work, even the CWU can't stop that, which is why you are back at work today.
I may be wrong, but reading some boards, it seems some of your offices have implimented the changes and are making it work.
If it works for some why not all, is the mangement better in some offices than in others, or are some offices just more militant than others?
I'm sure there are a huge number of posties who just want to get on with their job and do not give two hoots how it changes.
I think you should be pressing for no compulsory redundanies, and no compulsory reduction in hours from full to part time, and acept that the way you work may change, what's it matter as long as you have a job and are paid for your 40 hours?
Stop worrying about us we will do that.You should concentrate on the huge influx of CHEAPER labour about to enter G.B. from Romania and Bulgaria.Proper workers who dont spend all their time drinking tea and whistling at anyone in a skirt. You wont have a union to look after you at all.Ours may have it's faults but at least we have a half decent one.We are also united and stand and fight together something you lot would never do.You just go job to job with no real rights .
Yes ,you carry on and dont worry about us you have plenty on your plate. :mfo
all the plasterers job are already taken by the polish around here and lets be honest,its abit more skilled than srewing wood together..watch your back luddy
:mfo :mfo
