Whether it's in a DO or a MC is irrelevant. If someone doesn't use the equipment that they're supposed to be using it'll be a blameworthy
.
Trollies were never made mandatory across the board.
Most people who started in the last 10 years have probably never laid eyes on one never mind been trained to use one.
You would know this if you worked in delivery.
You're wasting your time with him, never worked in a DO, but apparently knows everything about them
It does baffle me as to why people don’t use them though.
I get it with things like blocks of flats and steep hills because they’re absolutely useless there but generally they take the strain off your back and with what’s coming next you’ll really need to take the strain off your body where you can.
I’ve had a few new starters look at me with a puzzled look when I’ve got the trolly out of the van.
Also , my last duty it was unavoidable. You had 2 heavy bags every loop because they made them way too long , on average about an hour or more, why would you even attempt to carry that.
As for splitting the loops , I did that and it didn’t work.
It does baffle me as to why people don’t use them though.
I get it with things like blocks of flats and steep hills because they’re absolutely useless there but generally they take the strain off your back and with what’s coming next you’ll really need to take the strain off your body where you can.
I’ve had a few new starters look at me with a puzzled look when I’ve got the trolly out of the van.
Also , my last duty it was unavoidable. You had 2 heavy bags every loop because they made them way too long , on average about an hour or more, why would you even attempt to carry that.
As for splitting the loops , I did that and it didn’t work.
I found them to be useless, i work in a hilly area and even though there are some flattish loops, using a LWT would be awkward and slow, it caused me more discomfort with arm strain, pulling and pushing, so i haven't used on in years!
It does baffle me as to why people don’t use them though.
I get it with things like blocks of flats and steep hills because they’re absolutely useless there but generally they take the strain off your back and with what’s coming next you’ll really need to take the strain off your body where you can.
I’ve had a few new starters look at me with a puzzled look when I’ve got the trolly out of the van.
Also , my last duty it was unavoidable. You had 2 heavy bags every loop because they made them way too long , on average about an hour or more, why would you even attempt to carry that.
As for splitting the loops , I did that and it didn’t work.
I found them to be useless, i work in a hilly area and even though there are some flattish loops, using a LWT would be awkward and slow, it caused me more discomfort with arm strain, pulling and pushing, so i haven't used on in years!
This is going to be the choice imo, slower with a lwt over an 8 hour plus day and probably 6 hour delivery span or the same but carrying a bag on your back.
What I’m really getting at is that even though there are exceptions that I’ve already mentioned , why would you put your body through that ? What reason would you do that for this company?
It does baffle me as to why people don’t use them though.
I get it with things like blocks of flats and steep hills because they’re absolutely useless there but generally they take the strain off your back and with what’s coming next you’ll really need to take the strain off your body where you can.
I’ve had a few new starters look at me with a puzzled look when I’ve got the trolly out of the van.
Also , my last duty it was unavoidable. You had 2 heavy bags every loop because they made them way too long , on average about an hour or more, why would you even attempt to carry that.
As for splitting the loops , I did that and it didn’t work.
I found them to be useless, i work in a hilly area and even though there are some flattish loops, using a LWT would be awkward and slow, it caused me more discomfort with arm strain, pulling and pushing, so i haven't used on in years!
This is going to be the choice imo, slower with a lwt over an 8 hour plus day and probably 6 hour delivery span or the same but carrying a bag on your back.
What I’m really getting at is that even though there are exceptions that I’ve already mentioned , why would you put your body through that ? What reason would you do that for this company?
I want to still be physically healthy by the time I retire so I shall be using an LWT on the loops that I can.
’You can't just ask customers what they want and then try to give that to them. By the time you get it built, they'll want something new.’
Whether it's in a DO or a MC is irrelevant. If someone doesn't use the equipment that they're supposed to be using it'll be a blameworthy
.
Trollies were never made mandatory across the board.
Most people who started in the last 10 years have probably never laid eyes on one never mind been trained to use one.
You would know this if you worked in delivery.
You're wasting your time with him, never worked in a DO, but apparently knows everything about them
Again, irrelevant.
If you're meant to use one or you have the option to use one and you don't, and then get injured, it'll be a blameworthy. It's the same for any other equipment, it doesn't matter if it's in a DO or a MC.
If you're meant to use one or you have the option to use one and you don't, and then get injured, it'll be a blameworthy. It's the same for any other equipment, it doesn't matter if it's in a DO or a MC.
The relevance is this:
Despite trolleys being mandatory for years nobody who has been injured on delivery while not using a trolley has heard the word blameworthy.
This is our experience of delivery offices up and down the country over the past few years.
The societies of consumption and squandering of material resources are incompatible with the idea of economic growth and a clean planet.
If you're meant to use one or you have the option to use one and you don't, and then get injured, it'll be a blameworthy. It's the same for any other equipment, it doesn't matter if it's in a DO or a MC.
The relevance is this:
Despite trolleys being mandatory for years nobody who has been injured on delivery while not using a trolley has heard the word blameworthy.
This is our experience of delivery offices up and down the country over the past few years.
Don't forget that there's a new board coming in soon, who knows what they'll change, just because it's not a blameworthy thing now in DOs, no one can guarantee that it won't be a blameworthy once the new board comes in. They're bound to be looking for savings.
There may be a new borad coming in however that does not absolve the new management or the old ones of certain responsibilities as regards to Custom and Practice, H&S and Dsiciplinary actions.
The following Text is AI generated.
Key Considerations Regarding "Custom and Practice":
Employer Awareness: If the employer was aware of and tolerated the unsafe "custom and practice," this could potentially weaken their case for dismissing an employee for engaging in that practice. However, it does not absolve the employer of their duty to ensure safe working practices going forward. They would be expected to take steps to stop the unsafe practice for everyone.
Severity of the Violation: A serious breach of health and safety that creates a high risk of harm is more likely to be considered fair grounds for dismissal, regardless of whether it was common practice.
Employee's Knowledge and Training: If the employee was not properly trained or made aware of the correct procedures and was simply following what everyone else did, this could be a mitigating factor in a disciplinary hearing and could potentially make a dismissal unfair.
Consistency: Employers should ideally take consistent action against all employees engaging in unsafe practices. Singling out one employee for dismissal when the practice was widespread and tolerated could lead to a claim of unfair dismissal.
In summary, while "custom and practice" of unsafe behavior doesn't excuse health and safety violations, it is a factor that an employment tribunal might consider when assessing the fairness of a dismissal. An employer has a responsibility to ensure safe working practices and can take disciplinary action against employees who breach these, but they must do so fairly and reasonably.
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The truth is the LWT was introduced at a time when mail volumes were considerably higher and have fallen out of use, into disrepair or just plain disappeared in the 15 years since mostly because they were no longer practical when a 30 min loop could be 1-2 bundles of mail.
Unfortunately the time these trolleys would have been more useful to use was the 10 years preceding the BT2010 agreement when people were going about like donkeys with 16kg+ on their backs.
I would like to think being as it's 2025 that the business could come up with something a bit more imaginative than a repurposed golf trolley, something electric that I can race a mobility scooter with would be nice.
The USO pilots are specifically built around the idea that we'll be continuing to deliver the format 3 and 4 parcels. It would be rather silly to go through that and then hive a great deal of our work off somewhere else rendering all of the outputs irrelevant.
I don't think that is what Davie Robertson said .
He certainly gave the impression that all size 3 and 4 parcels are going to Parcelforce in July after the tech upgrades in June.
Perhaps what he said and what he meant are 2 different things.
It would be silly to trial something and then make changes to render the trials irrelevant but we must remember this is Royal Mail and pointless, costly, contradictory and ultimately useless are the things we excel at.
The societies of consumption and squandering of material resources are incompatible with the idea of economic growth and a clean planet.
The USO pilots are specifically built around the idea that we'll be continuing to deliver the format 3 and 4 parcels. It would be rather silly to go through that and then hive a great deal of our work off somewhere else rendering all of the outputs irrelevant.
I don't think that is what Davie Robertson said .
He certainly gave the impression that all size 3 and 4 parcels are going to Parcelforce in July after the tech upgrades in June.
Perhaps what he said and what he meant are 2 different things.
It would be silly to trial something and then make changes to render the trials irrelevant but we must remember this is Royal Mail and pointless, costly, contradictory and ultimately useless are the things we excel at.
So what is your point here? Are you disagreeing with Woody or slandering Royal Mail?
The USO pilots are specifically built around the idea that we'll be continuing to deliver the format 3 and 4 parcels. It would be rather silly to go through that and then hive a great deal of our work off somewhere else rendering all of the outputs irrelevant.
I don't think that is what Davie Robertson said .
He certainly gave the impression that all size 3 and 4 parcels are going to Parcelforce in July after the tech upgrades in June.
Perhaps what he said and what he meant are 2 different things.
It would be silly to trial something and then make changes to render the trials irrelevant but we must remember this is Royal Mail and pointless, costly, contradictory and ultimately useless are the things we excel at.
I have it from the horse's mouth that the communication was poor and that it's format 4+ that are moving across not 3+4.
Format 4+ are oversized things like hoovers and microwaves that back in the day would have came through PF.
Apparently it's around 14 million items annually which sounds a lot but anything between 20-50 items a day from an office.
The USO pilots are specifically built around the idea that we'll be continuing to deliver the format 3 and 4 parcels. It would be rather silly to go through that and then hive a great deal of our work off somewhere else rendering all of the outputs irrelevant.
I don't think that is what Davie Robertson said .
He certainly gave the impression that all size 3 and 4 parcels are going to Parcelforce in July after the tech upgrades in June.
Perhaps what he said and what he meant are 2 different things.
It would be silly to trial something and then make changes to render the trials irrelevant but we must remember this is Royal Mail and pointless, costly, contradictory and ultimately useless are the things we excel at.
This isn’t the case. I read somewhere that only some large parcels (circa 12m?) are intended to be hived off — this represents less than 10%, no?
The USO pilots are specifically built around the idea that we'll be continuing to deliver the format 3 and 4 parcels. It would be rather silly to go through that and then hive a great deal of our work off somewhere else rendering all of the outputs irrelevant.
I don't think that is what Davie Robertson said .
He certainly gave the impression that all size 3 and 4 parcels are going to Parcelforce in July after the tech upgrades in June.
Perhaps what he said and what he meant are 2 different things.
It would be silly to trial something and then make changes to render the trials irrelevant but we must remember this is Royal Mail and pointless, costly, contradictory and ultimately useless are the things we excel at.
This isn’t the case. I read somewhere that only some large parcels (circa 12m?) are intended to be hived off — this represents less than 10%, no?
