CWU: Agreement reached on the biggest ever National uplift in Part time contracted hours

[claretandblue]

Going by the CWU video tonight, it looks like walking duties will be Mon-Fri every week (wait until you see the stampede for them!)
Driving duties will be offered the chance of a 4 day driving week (Wed-Saturday) followed by a 5 day walking duty the next week, giving a 9 day fortnight. Kind of what I thought it might end up like - if you want every weekend off, you will be walking miles to get it, but as a sweetener for having to work every second Saturday, you get an extra day off per fortnight. I'm torn with what I'd do given the option. Every Saturday off would be great, but so would a 4 day week consisting of driving only. Wouldn't fancy being the person who has to staff an office with shifts overlapping like that.

What happens to the Tracked/1c on Mondays and Tuesdays if the driving duties are all only Wed to Sat?

If "walking" days are all going to be 30/40 mins longer each day then that's even later finishes than we have at present.

It's a simplistic overview from Perseus, drivers would still work Monday and Tuesday but on rotation, but still with every other Saturday off. Going to be a knight mare to sort the staffing out as they can't even get people's days off right now.

[Perseus]

Going by the CWU video tonight, it looks like walking duties will be Mon-Fri every week (wait until you see the stampede for them!)
Driving duties will be offered the chance of a 4 day driving week (Wed-Saturday) followed by a 5 day walking duty the next week, giving a 9 day fortnight. Kind of what I thought it might end up like - if you want every weekend off, you will be walking miles to get it, but as a sweetener for having to work every second Saturday, you get an extra day off per fortnight. I'm torn with what I'd do given the option. Every Saturday off would be great, but so would a 4 day week consisting of driving only. Wouldn't fancy being the person who has to staff an office with shifts overlapping like that.

What happens to the Tracked/1c on Mondays and Tuesdays if the driving duties are all only Wed to Sat?

If "walking" days are all going to be 30/40 mins longer each day then that's even later finishes than we have at present.

It's a simplistic overview from Perseus, drivers would still work Monday and Tuesday but on rotation, but still with every other Saturday off. Going to be a knight mare to sort the staffing out as they can't even get people's days off right now.

It's not a simplistic overview from me, it's quoting what MW said in the latest video. Of course drivers will still be required on Mondays and Tuesdays - thats where I, and others have said it will be a total headache for a manager to staff these kind of systems - 5 day weeks working 7hr 40min days and 9 day fortnights working 8hr 15min a day. I didn't state that ALL drivers would be on a 9 day fortnight, just that there would be an option to reduce fatigue, by doing a walking week then a 4 day driving week. MW has already stated that it isn't going to work in rural areas.
All the signs are pointing to this being worked out at a local level, based on the most common attendance pattern of 1 in 6 (I think it was stated that 70% of offices are on that).
I'd echo what others have said, that many staff currently work 6 days a week and only ever take a day off when it falls on their Saturday. It's a hell of a big carrot to dangle in front of people - either every or every second Saturday off, but there clearly is a kicker with the longer days.

[claretandblue]

Going by the CWU video tonight, it looks like walking duties will be Mon-Fri every week (wait until you see the stampede for them!)
Driving duties will be offered the chance of a 4 day driving week (Wed-Saturday) followed by a 5 day walking duty the next week, giving a 9 day fortnight. Kind of what I thought it might end up like - if you want every weekend off, you will be walking miles to get it, but as a sweetener for having to work every second Saturday, you get an extra day off per fortnight. I'm torn with what I'd do given the option. Every Saturday off would be great, but so would a 4 day week consisting of driving only. Wouldn't fancy being the person who has to staff an office with shifts overlapping like that.

What happens to the Tracked/1c on Mondays and Tuesdays if the driving duties are all only Wed to Sat?

If "walking" days are all going to be 30/40 mins longer each day then that's even later finishes than we have at present.

It's a simplistic overview from Perseus, drivers would still work Monday and Tuesday but on rotation, but still with every other Saturday off. Going to be a knight mare to sort the staffing out as they can't even get people's days off right now.

It's not a simplistic overview from me, it's quoting what MW said in the latest video. Of course drivers will still be required on Mondays and Tuesdays - thats where I, and others have said it will be a total headache for a manager to staff these kind of systems - 5 day weeks working 7hr 40min days and 9 day fortnights working 8hr 15min a day. I didn't state that ALL drivers would be on a 9 day fortnight, just that there would be an option to reduce fatigue, by doing a walking week then a 4 day driving week. MW has already stated that it isn't going to work in rural areas.
All the signs are pointing to this being worked out at a local level, based on the most common attendance pattern of 1 in 6 (I think it was stated that 70% of offices are on that).
I'd echo what others have said, that many staff currently work 6 days a week and only ever take a day off when it falls on their Saturday. It's a hell of a big carrot to dangle in front of people - either every or every second Saturday off, but there clearly is a kicker with the longer days.

Alright then, you're just parroting what Walsh said, it's still a simplistic view.

[Perseus]

Going by the CWU video tonight, it looks like walking duties will be Mon-Fri every week (wait until you see the stampede for them!)
Driving duties will be offered the chance of a 4 day driving week (Wed-Saturday) followed by a 5 day walking duty the next week, giving a 9 day fortnight. Kind of what I thought it might end up like - if you want every weekend off, you will be walking miles to get it, but as a sweetener for having to work every second Saturday, you get an extra day off per fortnight. I'm torn with what I'd do given the option. Every Saturday off would be great, but so would a 4 day week consisting of driving only. Wouldn't fancy being the person who has to staff an office with shifts overlapping like that.

What happens to the Tracked/1c on Mondays and Tuesdays if the driving duties are all only Wed to Sat?

If "walking" days are all going to be 30/40 mins longer each day then that's even later finishes than we have at present.

It's a simplistic overview from Perseus, drivers would still work Monday and Tuesday but on rotation, but still with every other Saturday off. Going to be a knight mare to sort the staffing out as they can't even get people's days off right now.

It's not a simplistic overview from me, it's quoting what MW said in the latest video. Of course drivers will still be required on Mondays and Tuesdays - thats where I, and others have said it will be a total headache for a manager to staff these kind of systems - 5 day weeks working 7hr 40min days and 9 day fortnights working 8hr 15min a day. I didn't state that ALL drivers would be on a 9 day fortnight, just that there would be an option to reduce fatigue, by doing a walking week then a 4 day driving week. MW has already stated that it isn't going to work in rural areas.
All the signs are pointing to this being worked out at a local level, based on the most common attendance pattern of 1 in 6 (I think it was stated that 70% of offices are on that).
I'd echo what others have said, that many staff currently work 6 days a week and only ever take a day off when it falls on their Saturday. It's a hell of a big carrot to dangle in front of people - either every or every second Saturday off, but there clearly is a kicker with the longer days.

Alright then, you're just parroting what Walsh said, it's still a simplistic view.

You'll need to ask MW about the Mondays and Tuesdays, although I imagine IF, and it's a huge if 9 day fortnights with every second Saturday off and 5 day weeks with every Saturday off come to fruition, not many will care the staffing headache it leaves staffing wise on those days. Most people in our office want out, but getting a job that gives you 5-6 weeks holiday a year and little or no weekend work is a stumbling block.

[yellowbelly]

It's a simplistic overview from Perseus, drivers would still work Monday and Tuesday but on rotation, but still with every other Saturday off. Going to be a knight mare to sort the staffing out as they can't even get people's days off right now.

I don't know how why managers make it so difficult. Each section manager has a slightly different version of an excel spreadsheet to create a duty plan.
Then when a manager goes on holiday, sick whatever the other managers can't get access to that duty spreadsheet for that section or if they can they 'don't like the way that works'. Another duty plan spreadsheet gets created with the covering manager not knowing who does what, whose day off it is, who is on leave etc. It's abysmal. The amount of amended duty sheets that get printed out is crazy and they're still wrong.

RM pay IT geeks to put fancy messages and banners on our PDA's. Why don't they pay those same geeks to come up with a package of a small number of standardised duty plannner templates. Input bank of names, allocate names to duty's, day off rotation, leave etc. It's not rocket surgery.

[SpacePhoenix]

It's a simplistic overview from Perseus, drivers would still work Monday and Tuesday but on rotation, but still with every other Saturday off. Going to be a knight mare to sort the staffing out as they can't even get people's days off right now.

I don't know how why managers make it so difficult. Each section manager has a slightly different version of an excel spreadsheet to create a duty plan.
Then when a manager goes on holiday, sick whatever the other managers can't get access to that duty spreadsheet for that section or if they can they 'don't like the way that works'. Another duty plan spreadsheet gets created with the covering manager not knowing who does what, whose day off it is, who is on leave etc. It's abysmal. The amount of amended duty sheets that get printed out is crazy and they're still wrong.

RM pay IT geeks to put fancy messages and banners on our PDA's. Why don't they pay those same geeks to come up with a package of a small number of standardised duty plannner templates. Input bank of names, allocate names to duty's, day off rotation, leave etc. It's not rocket surgery.

A lot of that info must be on PSP

[norris9]

Back to the seniority stuff...still need to clarify something...

From the CWU Live last night....

Martin Walsh: "(When a PT postie is working extra hours) there should be a case going to the manager that THAT postie should be made up, that should be done on seniority. There's difficulties with this as I might be a postie that does a regular 20 hours a week overtime, but not the senior one, but seniority is what we've agreed so the most senior PT has the opportunity to get an increase in hours".

For me - this wasn't entirely clear what he meant...

So basic question - who would get offered the uplift in hours - the PT postie doing the extra hours, or the PT postie who isn't doing any overtime who started working for Royal Mail first?

I assume it's the longer serving postie that isn't doing the overtime that will get the offer. It's just confusing because Martin started by saying that THAT postie doing the overtime should be made up.

If it is offered to the postie who came through the door first - then no complaints - that's how it should be done.

[Dexydog]

He seemed to make it pretty clear the union thought it wasn't "fair" that the one doing less overtime should get the uplift even though they might have been here longer.
It stinks.

[yellowbelly]

Back to the seniority stuff...still need to clarify something...

From the CWU Live last night....

Martin Walsh: "(When a PT postie is working extra hours) there should be a case going to the manager that THAT postie should be made up, that should be done on seniority. There's difficulties with this as I might be a postie that does a regular 20 hours a week overtime, but not the senior one, but seniority is what we've agreed so the most senior PT has the opportunity to get an increase in hours".

For me - this wasn't entirely clear what he meant...

So basic question - who would get offered the uplift in hours - the PT postie doing the extra hours, or the PT postie who isn't doing any overtime who started working for Royal Mail first?

I assume it's the longer serving postie that isn't doing the overtime that will get the offer. It's just confusing because Martin started by saying that THAT postie doing the overtime should be made up.

If it is offered to the postie who came through the door first - then no complaints - that's how it should be done.

There's always going to be anomalies and it depends on the circumstances that have created the situation where the junior postie is working the extra hours - for example in the situation described above, perhaps the junior postie does four days a week, works an extra day on OT and two hours a morning on early IPS for example and is happy to do that, that makes up the twenty hours(ish).

Perhaps the senior postie similarly does four days but doesn't want to work their additional day off and can't get in early to do the early IPS due to child care/transport etc.

Then the junior postie is going to get the uplift offer. It should of course be a matter of management skills/workplace courtesy that the senior postie gets asked can you do these uplift of hours on day off and IPS, which is likely to be no. Prevents mutterings in the background of 'Well I wasn't offered the opportunity' - even though they were unlikely to accept.

[Londonsburning]

He seemed to make it pretty clear the union thought it wasn't "fair" that the one doing less overtime should get the uplift even though they might have been here longer.
It stinks.

That sounds just like the original seniority set up that RM works with. Not sure why CWU would be against this tbh. It's the fairest way and surely avoids favouritism, especially in DOs and MCs with 100+ employees

[Dexydog]

Well that's what the union seem to be saying.
Maybe RM are telling them to say that as part of the deal.
Either that or seniority isn't important to them anymore.

[CharlesSpooner]

Take your office for example, I have no idea if you work a shared van, HCT or single van duty, or whatever else there may be.
Lets take a shared van for instance that currently needs to go 1hr over to complete. If you are delivering all of one duty, all letters, packets etc, but only 1st class letters and packets/specials on the second duty - would you not think that comfortably eats into that 1hr you need to go over? Next time you sort a frame, count how many first class letters there are - there will be a handful.

In our office the shared van duties frequently bring back a full duty of mail as it is. Tracked and Specials only on the second duty. No matter what systems come into play the kicker will always be that they make the duties longer and therefore ultimately don't solve any issues.

When DPR duties were brought in it wasn't seen as an opportunity to alleviate pressure on walks that were constantly failing. It was seen as an opportunity to make those walks longer (now they don't have large parcels) so didn't resolve any issues with deliveries failing. It was simply a tool to justify removing duties. Of course the DPR parcels are now regularly getting put back on walks.

This new system will be the same. It won't aim to make workloads manageable, it will be used to justify longer, and therefore less, duties.

[BadPostman]

Any way to find out if our name is on the list? My office doesn't have a rep

[ted_e_bear]

Any way to find out if our name is on the list? My office doesn't have a rep

Yes link to download the list of all offices with the numbers of people who are affected
https://www.cwu.org/wp-content/uploads/ ... Att-3.xlsx

[norris9]

How do others feel about walking for 5 days straight each week? and how do full timers feel about working a 9 hour 25 minute day on the 4 day weeks? For new starts on the 40 hour contracts that's a 10 hour day!

A lot of people already do 6 days straight when working their day off or those that dont do 5 days straight in the week before and after their long weekends so I dont think it'd cause much of an uproar but everyone has different levels of fitness/age etc

I doubt the amount of people that do 6 days a week is anymore than 5% across the whole country. I'd actually expect it to be more like 2% or less. Very few people do that in our office.