CWU and EP LTB 393/24 – ROYAL MAIL GROUP TAKEOVER BID

[A2B]

Under 35hrs i believe

[clashcityrocker]

DPR driver jobs are the most unsafe because Parcelforce are very short of work and it will get worse after Christmas .
Most likely Parcelforce will be join up with royal mail next year and then no need for DPR routes ,

Or no need for any ParcelForce drivers?
It would depend on the types of contracts involved I suppose.

[norris9]

The 37 'Pilot sites' piloting the new USO plans..... do we have a list of those anywhere?

I asked in the live video session.
CWU said the list comes out tomorrow morning.

That will create some Christmas cheer

It actually will for those doing the pilots that want VR.... they said in the CWU Live that there would be VRs at those offices.

[Hitcher]

Additionally, both parties recognise that the nature of legally binding agreements requires a clause
that protects the parties in the event circumstances were to arise that threaten the ongoing viability
and very existence of RMG. Therefore, in such circumstances, EP Group reserves the right to withdraw from the legally binding commitments set out in 3.1 to 3.5 above upon a three months
notice to CWU.

[TopperGas]

Martin Walsh '11,000 Part Timers will now be moved to Full Time from the 1st January' ?

Surely you mean they will be given the option to go full time? as some surely won't want to.

What denotes a Part Timer anyway, anyone under 30 hours a week? or under 35 hours a week?

EDIT: I see now, he repeated this later on but clarified it's for people that have a 'variation contract'... I assume that means people that are doing early overtime every single day.

What's one of those as I've been working OT &/or SA since I started working for RM 5 years ago bit just have, I assume, a normal p/t'ers contract?

It seems a bit odd the moves now taking place before the takeover is completed what happens if the EU block it, or something else unforeseen means that the EP group decide not to proceed?

[A2B]

The 37 'Pilot sites' piloting the new USO plans..... do we have a list of those anywhere?

I asked in the live video session.
CWU said the list comes out tomorrow morning.

That will create some Christmas cheer

It actually will for those doing the pilots that want VR.... they said in the CWU Live that there would be VRs at those offices.

And if there's not enough in the office who want VR?

2025 brings a new indoor work plan, potential loss of duty and if you're very unlucky you're unwillinlgy looking for a new job

[Smoothbackground]

I definitely think dpr duties will be one of the first things to go.

Letters are in terminal decline.
Parcels are where the money is. The parcel sorting machines seem to prefer larger parcels.
They talk about the need to grow the next day delivery market.
I would say the only job that is safe in RM is a DPR driver.

I completely agree. Anyone speculating to the contrary is deluding themselves.

DPR driver jobs are the most unsafe because Parcelforce are very short of work and it will get worse after Christmas .
Most likely Parcelforce will be join up with royal mail next year and then no need for DPR routes ,
which makes sense anyway as there are too many people going to the same addresses .

There might be some unifying of the networks to feed Parcelforce some large and heavy work in the short term but I can’t see the operations being consolidated beyond that. Interesting to see what will happen to PFW in the medium to long term.

[Perseus]

I stand corrected. Martin Walsh has stated that of the 37 offices some by deploying this pilot will create surplus staff, but they will not be moved, there will be work for them. I'm not convinced.

MW also said staff in the pilot offices will be offered increased VR, which suggests they'll be reduced numbers of staff in those offices?

What if staff don't want the VR? It's been stated they won't be moved, and there will be no compulsory redundancies, but there will be staff made surplus. Annoy people until they leave?
Or maybe that is one of the criteria they used to select the 37 offices - ones most likely to accept VR.
I know the pilots have been chosen to be a mix of city/town/rural but the real indicator in all this is how many 1st class letters the average duty of 600-800 houses gets daily. 30-40 maybe? Add them to the parcels for that duty on a standard, non Christmas time of year levels, and you are lucky to be hitting 100 delivery points instead of the usual 80% of 600 houses on an average day. And that is for every second walk in the office, swapping over the next day. Duty A gets everything one day, whereas B gets only 100 items (half of which letters) which can be done in 2 hours instead of 5 if driven round (good for the environment )
I'm hopeful we can get updates on these pilots to see how they actually work in practice.

[Barnacle]

I definitely think dpr duties will be one of the first things to go.

Letters are in terminal decline.
Parcels are where the money is. The parcel sorting machines seem to prefer larger parcels.
They talk about the need to grow the next day delivery market.
I would say the only job that is safe in RM is a DPR driver.

I completely agree. Anyone speculating to the contrary is deluding themselves.

DPR driver jobs are the most unsafe because Parcelforce are very short of work and it will get worse after Christmas .
Most likely Parcelforce will be join up with royal mail next year and then no need for DPR routes ,
which makes sense anyway as there are too many people going to the same addresses .

Absolutely agree. It has been beyond ridiculous for RM to set up DPR in order to concentrate on parcels, when there has been ParcelForce sitting there the entire time. I for one will get the bunting out when we are reintegrated.

[yellowbelly]

Additionally, both parties recognise that the nature of legally binding agreements requires a clause
that protects the parties in the event circumstances were to arise that threaten the ongoing viability
and very existence of RMG. Therefore, in such circumstances, EP Group reserves the right to withdraw from the legally binding commitments set out in 3.1 to 3.5 above upon a three months
notice to CWU.

Good spot Hitcher! That plus the fact that CWU have described this agreement as 'ground-breaking' doesn't inspire me with confidence.
Anyone remember 'Deal of the Century'?

[norris9]

Additionally, both parties recognise that the nature of legally binding agreements requires a clause
that protects the parties in the event circumstances were to arise that threaten the ongoing viability
and very existence of RMG. Therefore, in such circumstances, EP Group reserves the right to withdraw from the legally binding commitments set out in 3.1 to 3.5 above upon a three months
notice to CWU.

Good spot Hitcher! That plus the fact that CWU have described this agreement as 'ground-breaking' doesn't inspire me with confidence.
Anyone remember 'Deal of the Century'?

I personally have a good feeling about this takeover. I feel as if Kretinsky actually wants to grow the business and has ideas that will come to fruition next year.

At the end of the day the company was on a massive downward trajectory, this deal at least gives me some hope. Maybe we will get offices that run more efficiently where the workload is fair. It isn't working like that now and hasn't for a long time.

If it doesn't work out and mail is dying out and the gig economy is too much competition for us - then so be it....there may not be a way to compete without joining them in gig land.

[TopperGas]

I stand corrected. Martin Walsh has stated that of the 37 offices some by deploying this pilot will create surplus staff, but they will not be moved, there will be work for them. I'm not convinced.

MW also said staff in the pilot offices will be offered increased VR, which suggests they'll be reduced numbers of staff in those offices?

What if staff don't want the VR? It's been stated they won't be moved, and there will be no compulsory redundancies, but there will be staff made surplus. Annoy people until they leave?
Or maybe that is one of the criteria they used to select the 37 offices - ones most likely to accept VR.
I know the pilots have been chosen to be a mix of city/town/rural but the real indicator in all this is how many 1st class letters the average duty of 600-800 houses gets daily. 30-40 maybe? Add them to the parcels for that duty on a standard, non Christmas time of year levels, and you are lucky to be hitting 100 delivery points instead of the usual 80% of 600 houses on an average day. And that is for every second walk in the office, swapping over the next day. Duty A gets everything one day, whereas B gets only 100 items (half of which letters) which can be done in 2 hours instead of 5 if driven round (good for the environment )
I'm hopeful we can get updates on these pilots to see how they actually work in practice.

I thought the plan was for the DPR driver to cover two rounds each day. so that's 4+ hours of delivery each day not just the 2 hours?

What I can't get my head around is the 2c duty, as I took out part of a duty today which hadn't gone out this week and virtually every post had mail, what normally takes 1 hours took me 1.5 hours, there's no way I could have done the full duty. You also get lumbered with delivering D2D's for every house at the start of the week if they've all been thrown in by mid week. I feel the rounds will have to be cut by 25% to make them achievable but TB claimed they weren't being reduced.

[Perseus]

Additionally, both parties recognise that the nature of legally binding agreements requires a clause
that protects the parties in the event circumstances were to arise that threaten the ongoing viability
and very existence of RMG. Therefore, in such circumstances, EP Group reserves the right to withdraw from the legally binding commitments set out in 3.1 to 3.5 above upon a three months
notice to CWU.

Good spot Hitcher! That plus the fact that CWU have described this agreement as 'ground-breaking' doesn't inspire me with confidence.
Anyone remember 'Deal of the Century'?

and the 'no strike clause'

[Pidleypoo]

I definitely think dpr duties will be one of the first things to go.

Letters are in terminal decline.
Parcels are where the money is. The parcel sorting machines seem to prefer larger parcels.
They talk about the need to grow the next day delivery market.
I would say the only job that is safe in RM is a DPR driver.

I completely agree. Anyone speculating to the contrary is deluding themselves.

DPR driver jobs are the most unsafe because Parcelforce are very short of work and it will get worse after Christmas .
Most likely Parcelforce will be join up with royal mail next year and then no need for DPR routes ,
which makes sense anyway as there are too many people going to the same addresses .

There might be some unifying of the networks to feed Parcelforce some large and heavy work in the short term but I can’t see the operations being consolidated beyond that. Interesting to see what will happen to PFW in the medium to long term.

There’s going to be one network.

[Barnacle]

Additionally, both parties recognise that the nature of legally binding agreements requires a clause
that protects the parties in the event circumstances were to arise that threaten the ongoing viability
and very existence of RMG. Therefore, in such circumstances, EP Group reserves the right to withdraw from the legally binding commitments set out in 3.1 to 3.5 above upon a three months
notice to CWU.

Good spot Hitcher! That plus the fact that CWU have described this agreement as 'ground-breaking' doesn't inspire me with confidence.
Anyone remember 'Deal of the Century'?

and the 'no strike clause'

There is no ‘No Strike Clause’.

Also, being able to exit a legally binding agreement if staying within the agreement is causing the company to fall into administration, is a pretty standard exit clause in legally binding agreements.

For the exit clause to be implemented, the consequences of not exiting would have to be dire.