Genuinely shocked

[Weetrogg2]

As an employee for over 25 years and a rep for 17 years I can honestly say I have never seen such dreadful deal.

There’s been some poor parts of agreements in the past but this literally is a surrender deal. The only part of the union that gets anything out of it is Div reps and above

I’m still reeling from the fact that the PEC really expects me to believe they have won anything for the membership

Why would any union expect their members to agree to give up sick pay (which was fought for over decades)

I’m genuinely shocked at how appalling this agreement is and it’s only made worse by senior leadership trying to tell us it’s a good deal

I don’t know what happens if the members don’t except the deal but I do know that I cannot vote for it.

[Eduardo]

Is there anyone here who disagrees that something had to be done about the number of illegitimate sick absences?
Does anyone here think that the process of self certification is not being abused?
Has anyone here a better resolution to fraudulent use of sick pay other than what is proposed in this deal?
Thanks.

[Weetrogg2]

They have agreed to to make the attendance procedure more stringent which should make it harder for the small minority of piss takers.

Next year they will be back to reduce our sick pay for the first week of absence. I have not been sick for over 5 years but in a job where they want you to work harder and walk further, in all weathers reducing the sick will affect everybody not just those who abuse it.

[k979aaa]

Is there anyone here who disagrees that something had to be done about the number of illegitimate sick absences?
Does anyone here think that the process of self certification is not being abused?
Has anyone here a better resolution to fraudulent use of sick pay other than what is proposed in this deal?
Thanks.

Look this is not a policy by RM but the government tell you to self cert and doctors say the same I would wager It would be Illegal and they would be found guilty as charged if someone took it to court!

[sweepster70]

They have agreed to to make the attendance procedure more stringent which should make it harder for the small minority of piss takers.

Next year they will be back to reduce our sick pay for the first week of absence. I have not been sick for over 5 years but in a job where they want you to work harder and walk further, in all weathers reducing the sick will affect everybody not just those who abuse it.

Anybody can say they're a Rep on here, and you might be. Why would they be back next year to reduce our sick pay for the first week, when it's a two year deal? Surely as a Rep you would know this.

[deadbox]

Is there anyone here who disagrees that something had to be done about the number of illegitimate sick absences?
Does anyone here think that the process of self certification is not being abused?
Has anyone here a better resolution to fraudulent use of sick pay other than what is proposed in this deal?
Thanks.

Every job I’ve been in has had people who have pushed the limits on sick leave, businesses build in to their forecasts/ business plans for sickness, holidays, pregnancy etc.

Royal Mail are just greedy, they want a bigger slice of the cake, they’re not happy with a profit, they want all the money. Dispite making £768 million profit, they want more. They want not only their slice of the cake, they want everyone else’s cake slice too, even the crumbs.

Nothing will ever satisfy their greed, so it’s up to the reasonable people to control their greed. Like a drug addict, they will cheat & lie to get what they want.

Dispite their claim that we’re bleeding £1.6M a day , I have read only today that the £400M loss this year is looking more like a £46M loss. And as we’ve taken about £200M strike action, if RM hadn’t taken executive action, we’d be in profit !

Our T&C’s CAN be maintained, it just means that the company won’t make as much profit for the shareholder

[Weetrogg2]

35 hr week was in an agreement but I still have to work 37 because the business changed their minds. This proposed agreement is not a legally binding document, RM can change it, ignore or walk away from it any time they like.

Why would I say I was a rep if i wasn’t??

[Weetrogg2]

They have agreed to to make the attendance procedure more stringent which should make it harder for the small minority of piss takers.

Next year they will be back to reduce our sick pay for the first week of absence. I have not been sick for over 5 years but in a job where they want you to work harder and walk further, in all weathers reducing the sick will affect everybody not just those who abuse it.

Anybody can say they're a Rep on here, and you might be. Why would they be back next year to reduce our sick pay for the first week, when it's a two year deal? Surely as a Rep you would know this.

As a rep who’s had to work with every national agreement since 2007, I’m just stating my opinion that this is by far and away the worst agreement I have ever seen.

I’m glad for you and your office sweepster that you’re managers always follow the national agreements to the letter and never renege on anything.

[k979aaa]

35 hr week was in an agreement but I still have to work 37 because the business changed their minds. This proposed agreement is not a legally binding document, RM can change it, ignore or walk away from it any time they like.

Why would I say I was a rep if i wasn’t??

35 hour full-time is 50 minutes less meal relife a week than 36 hours or 35.5 hour week? As to is he a rep probably and is it relevant on here most of us all are in more communication than them. As to the legally binding bit they did walk away from the pervious agreements and nothing will stop them again!

[Zicomurphy]

I think nearly all of us think it’s a bad deal. For me it’s not really a shock. I’ve expected for a long time that this dispute would end with us accepting watered down versions of most aspects of what Royal Mail wanted at the start in return for a mediocre pay increase and that exactly what the deal looks like to me. It became even more obvious we would not get a good deal when the CWU started echoing the company statements on its precarious financial position.

[pinstripe]

Anybody can say they're a Rep on here, and you might be. Why would they be back next year to reduce our sick pay for the first week, when it's a two year deal? Surely as a Rep you would know this.

I’m not a rep, but experience shows me RM will likely break this agreement before the ink is even dry. Remember the joint statement regarding pausing revisions? That was just the latest.

[Mickeybrowneyes]

Is there anyone here who disagrees that something had to be done about the number of illegitimate sick absences?
Does anyone here think that the process of self certification is not being abused?
Has anyone here a better resolution to fraudulent use of sick pay other than what is proposed in this deal?
Thanks.

Every job I’ve been in has had people who have pushed the limits on sick leave, businesses build in to their forecasts/ business plans for sickness, holidays, pregnancy etc.

Royal Mail are just greedy, they want a bigger slice of the cake, they’re not happy with a profit, they want all the money. Dispite making £768 million profit, they want more. They want not only their slice of the cake, they want everyone else’s cake slice too, even the crumbs.

Nothing will ever satisfy their greed, so it’s up to the reasonable people to control their greed. Like a drug addict, they will cheat & lie to get what they want.

Dispite their claim that we’re bleeding £1.6M a day , I have read only today that the £400M loss this year is looking more like a £46M loss. And as we’ve taken about £200M strike action, if RM hadn’t taken executive action, we’d be in profit !

Our T&C’s CAN be maintained, it just means that the company won’t make as much profit for the shareholder

Where did you read this?
Have you a link to the article?

[scotchy1962]

We surely all can agree on one thing, RM cannot and should not be trusted, as has been said already they couldnt even make it through negotiations without saying one thing and then doing the opposite, until theres a cull at the top table we are going to be constantly under attack from these idiots.
The pay deal as it sits is a dead dog to most sensible people, never mind the % rise its the vague explanations of what it is they want in return, which will leave us open to management interpretation and a right kicking for us.
If theres something they should realise with RM.... get a protocol for everything they want us to do right down to the crossed Ts and dotted i, its the only way to stop them abusing it.

[pinstripe]

I agree Scotchy, but even if the agreement was crystal clear, with every i dotted and t crossed, unless it was legally binding, with substantial monetary penalties for breaking it, would anyone trust RM to honour it?

Which side has a habit of breaking agreements?

[iHateD2Ds]

The changes to the sick policy is appalling,when will the greed ever stop?
Come 2025 they will attack us again!

It’s a poor deal ,we deserve better.
Use your vote.