So what exactly does the joint statement mean?

[SMS1969]

Thank you Martin Walsh for your thorough update .

If your office / MC has problems with this, then don’t stand for it. Woodie has told you all what to do, there’s no excuse so don’t stand for it and fight back.

[SpacePhoenix]

Girvan in Ayrshire could possibly be the first test, apparently the local manager intends to proceed with the unagreed revision on Monday.
I believe it's already triggered a "flashpoint".
We'll see if the joint statement has teeth.

Apparently Newcastle MC walked out today.

Wonder if RM will try diverting mail to the adjacent MCs

[Woody Guthrie]

Martin, the union has basically green lighted the huge increase in workload that these revisions will bring. .

Huge increase in workload?
Less than a year ago our revision planned the duties at around 4hrs 30 minutes.
At the moment our duties are averaging 3hrs 45 minutes.
Far less on some days.
There has been a huge decrease in workload over the past 12 months.
The very worst the revision will do in our office will be to add another 40 minutes back on to each duty which won't even take it back to last year's duty span.
I'm being brutally honest which seems to be in short supply on this forum. Everyone seems to be remarkably overworked even though we are woefully short of work at the moment.

I'm aware that some offices seem to get screwed over more than others but sometimes on here people try to imply that what happens in their office applies across the country. It doesn't.

The union has basically given our office the tools to protect our start times and attendance patterns, it was never about stopping joint revisions which were agreed to in the previous deal and which are badly needed if I'm honest. If your revision in your office turns out to be a mess there are tools available in the joint statement for addressing that but they don't work all by themselves. You have to also ask why it's a mess though.

[Kenfandango]

When (if) the economy improves and people start ordering stuff again, will they revise the walks back down to "realsize" the business again?

We all know the answer to that

[Acca Dacca]

Martin, the union has basically green lighted the huge increase in workload that these revisions will bring. .

Huge increase in workload?
Less than a year ago our revision planned the duties at around 4hrs 30 minutes.
At the moment our duties are averaging 3hrs 45 minutes.
Far less on some days.
There has been a huge decrease in workload over the past 12 months.
The very worst the revision will do in our office will be to add another 40 minutes back on to each duty which won't even take it back to last year's duty span.
I'm being brutally honest which seems to be in short supply on this forum. Everyone seems to be remarkably overworked even though we are woefully short of work at the moment.

I'm aware that some offices seem to get screwed over more than others but sometimes on here people try to imply that what happens in their office applies across the country. It doesn't.

You are doing the same thing Woody by implying others arent being honest about the workload because your office has 3 hour 45 duties

[stevejm]

Martin, the union has basically green lighted the huge increase in workload that these revisions will bring. .

Huge increase in workload?
Less than a year ago our revision planned the duties at around 4hrs 30 minutes.
At the moment our duties are averaging 3hrs 45 minutes.
Far less on some days.
There has been a huge decrease in workload over the past 12 months.
The very worst the revision will do in our office will be to add another 40 minutes back on to each duty which won't even take it back to last year's duty span.
I'm being brutally honest which seems to be in short supply on this forum. Everyone seems to be remarkably overworked even though we are woefully short of work at the moment.

I'm aware that some offices seem to get screwed over more than others but sometimes on here people try to imply that what happens in their office applies across the country. It doesn't.

The union has basically given our office the tools to protect our start times and attendance patterns, it was never about stopping joint revisions which were agreed to in the previous deal and which are badly needed if I'm honest. If your revision in your office turns out to be a mess there are tools available in the joint statement for addressing that but they don't work all by themselves. You have to also ask why it's a mess though.

Neither you nor RM seem to take into account that we are all walking further and further every day - we are not robots. There should be a union negotiated agreement limiting how many miles we walk every week/month/year.

[clashcityrocker]

The very worst the revision will do in our office will be to add another 40 minutes back on to each duty which won't even take it back to last year's duty span.

What about the increase in efficiency that accompanies the revision?

There are only 2 ways to increase your efficiency.
1.The same work with fewer hours or
2.More work with the same hours.

Either way it isn't the status quo. It means more work for the workers.

[sixfoottwo]

Martin, the union has basically green lighted the huge increase in workload that these revisions will bring. .

Huge increase in workload?
Less than a year ago our revision planned the duties at around 4hrs 30 minutes.
At the moment our duties are averaging 3hrs 45 minutes.
Far less on some days.
There has been a huge decrease in workload over the past 12 months.
The very worst the revision will do in our office will be to add another 40 minutes back on to each duty which won't even take it back to last year's duty span.
I'm being brutally honest which seems to be in short supply on this forum. Everyone seems to be remarkably overworked even though we are woefully short of work at the moment.

I'm aware that some offices seem to get screwed over more than others but sometimes on here people try to imply that what happens in their office applies across the country. It doesn't.

The union has basically given our office the tools to protect our start times and attendance patterns, it was never about stopping joint revisions which were agreed to in the previous deal and which are badly needed if I'm honest. If your revision in your office turns out to be a mess there are tools available in the joint statement for addressing that but they don't work all by themselves. You have to also ask why it's a mess though.

That bit is about right on our walks since the revision (other people seem to have miles less for some reason) the problem is we were bringing back at least 4 loops before this AND they decided to get rid of all the Parcel duties and put them back onto the walks too just for good measure

The result? we are literally doing parcels only on both plus the lapsed part and ZERO mail on our own walks, this has happened all this week since the car crash of a revision

[needadvice]

The CWU have made the massive mistake of trusting the integrity of Royal Mail.
We all know whatever Royal Mail say and actually do is a different matter altogether.

True, CWU have given RM too much slack. But what could they do when RM have given no slack at all? We all know what is acceptable and reasonable and we all know RM are too fantastical in their approach

We needed to strike for a long enough period to back up the operation beyond the few days here and there that gave that operation a reasonable recovery time. We needed a solid two week rolling strike, and we needed a Union who didn't make legal mistakes when announcing the days we were supposed to strike.

Let's hope the CWU will up the ante, now we know what we are dealing with. A few days here and there is pointless

[k979aaa]

No i don't agree with that at all lets see the talks progress and then if need be take action but one thing is sure this cannot carry on till the end of this year!

[Woody Guthrie]

The very worst the revision will do in our office will be to add another 40 minutes back on to each duty which won't even take it back to last year's duty span.

What about the increase in efficiency that accompanies the revision?

There are only 2 ways to increase your efficiency.
1.The same work with fewer hours or
2.More work with the same hours.

Either way it isn't the status quo. It means more work for the workers.

The increase in efficiency can come from indoor workload or outdoor workload.

[postieblueshirt]

Our walks are 4:45 now I'm as efficient as there going to get I've got nothing left to give.home life?nah cinema? Nah il fall asleep,sexlife? Forget it doll I'm knackered.the job like me is fu***d.

[Martin Walsh]

A few observations from the Posts.

1. If we were not in dispute and the Pathway to Change Agreement was still in place that agreement committed every unit to a revision this year and next based on improving local productivity.

2. There has been traffic loss. Royal Mail’s revision targets are based on minus 7% but that is now over 10% in most units on even parcels streams.

3. How anyone does not see the significance of Simon Thompson the CEO being replaced in the talks and he had been in the majority of meetings since the new year is beyond me. Think about it the CEO being removed from the talks and two non executive board members who don’t work for Royal Mail replace him. One is a Lawyer and the other works for TFL. How does that strengthen the CEO’s hand ? ?

4. Of course it is Royal Mails mismanagement which has caused the financial crisis. However the seriousness of it is undeniable. Remember there are announcements which impact the share price and therefore the seriousness of the situation for many is just a tool to criticise.

5. The CWU are determined to get an agreement which is acceptable to the members. This means on pay and change.

6. On later starts due to Royal Mail coming off planes. There would always have been a move on start times as that work which is part of the USO has to now come by rail or road. However we do not agree with the three buckets which Royal Mail have provided where 700 units have a later start of over an hour. This is part of the negotiation.

7. We are not going to agree annualised hours which is total flexibility. However we are in discussions over seasonal variations. We all know for 12 weeks in the summer traffic reduces and absorption increases. Why ? productivity is simply if you have less traffic then you need less hours but the vast majority of units have the same number of duties 52 weeks per year. So the discussions are about individuals knowing what hours they will be working a year ahead.

8. We have achieved a number of concessions :

A) Sundays to be voluntary
B) Sunday allowances to be retained on a reserve rights basis.
C) A commitment on no compulsory redundancies which is not time limited.
D) RRIS to remain on a reserve rights basis.
E) TPM to remain on a reserve rights basis.
F) ILL Health Retirement to remain unchanged.

[chrisj]

Is that it?

Omg! After 1 year of negotiations and dispute and loss of money...

The only significant one is Ill health retirement - just saying, for those that deserve it...

Well folks. Pack up and grease up...

[Dexydog]

A few observations from the Posts.

1. If we were not in dispute and the Pathway to Change Agreement was still in place that agreement committed every unit to a revision this year and next based on improving local productivity.

2. There has been traffic loss. Royal Mail’s revision targets are based on minus 7% but that is now over 10% in most units on even parcels streams.

3. How anyone does not see the significance of Simon Thompson the CEO being replaced in the talks and he had been in the majority of meetings since the new year is beyond me. Think about it the CEO being removed from the talks and two non executive board members who don’t work for Royal Mail replace him. One is a Lawyer and the other works for TFL. How does that strengthen the CEO’s hand ? ?

4. Of course it is Royal Mails mismanagement which has caused the financial crisis. However the seriousness of it is undeniable. Remember there are announcements which impact the share price and therefore the seriousness of the situation for many is just a tool to criticise.

5. The CWU are determined to get an agreement which is acceptable to the members. This means on pay and change.

6. On later starts due to Royal Mail coming off planes. There would always have been a move on start times as that work which is part of the USO has to now come by rail or road. However we do not agree with the three buckets which Royal Mail have provided where 700 units have a later start of over an hour. This is part of the negotiation.

7. We are not going to agree annualised hours which is total flexibility. However we are in discussions over seasonal variations. We all know for 12 weeks in the summer traffic reduces and absorption increases. Why ? productivity is simply if you have less traffic then you need less hours but the vast majority of units have the same number of duties 52 weeks per year. So the discussions are about individuals knowing what hours they will be working a year ahead.

8. We have achieved a number of concessions :

A) Sundays to be voluntary
B) Sunday allowances to be retained on a reserve rights basis.
C) A commitment on no compulsory redundancies which is not time limited.
D) RRIS to remain on a reserve rights basis.
E) TPM to remain on a reserve rights basis.
F) ILL Health Retirement to remain unchanged.

1. Fair enough.
2. They're adding more than 10% onto our workload. ( not including the time it takes to do customer collections and all the extra photos etc. etc.)
3. Ward kept on saying he Thompson was nowhere to be seen in talks.
4. The share price went up nearly 6% on Friday, slowly up over the course of the last couple of weeks.
5. Jolly good, that's why we pay our subs.
6. RM were frightening everyone with tales of hours later- why didn't the union say something to mitigate; it was just scaremongering, like most of the rest.
7. Isn't that why lapsing came in for the summer period ffs?? (Annualised hours was never a serious prospect, most probably illegal and everyone knew it).
8. Sundays were never going to happen, they don't need us all in- that was obvious from the start.
I did some Sundays at xmas- got paid 4 quid an hour less than the casuals who basically did sweet fa.

So, Martin, tell me again why it's taken all this time to get to this point?- where the pay rise, which is all most people are bothered about, is going to be less than inflation.

You can dress it up all you like, the union has messed up big time.
I appreciate what they were up against, but come on, they have made error after error and here we are.