Breaking - RMPP RMSPS - update on tax- 18 1st June application for winter payment 2020, diary time line

[Steve_claret]

Yep, when you crunch the numbers like that 27 years does seem a long time to break even. In theory it would be slightly less though due to the extra annual increases and the additional widows pension but I get your thinking and any break even of 20+ years would be a gamble.

[stephen500]

Yep, when you crunch the numbers like that 27 years does seem a long time to break even. In theory it would be slightly less though due to the extra annual increases and the additional widows pension but I get your thinking and any break even of 20+ years would be a gamble.

and the widow's one you won't get till you are dead.

[stephen500]

Received a e mail today telling me that they can't give quotes more than 5 months in advance.(i want my pensions in Nov) So I have to apply for a quote on 1st July, updates to follow.

[stephen500]

Received further e mail, I am still getting a quote as that was already processed, but I just have to ammend the date I want the pension (plus lump sums)
They also told me I must not resign before I have my pensions in payment, other wise they will have to cancel the process and I would have to apply again.
I always used to wonder why on Capitas site, they mention that they pay pensions to those who have left Royal Mail.(they still pay them to those who are still working for RM, but it seems you would have to go through RMPP at the start)
It makes sense now.
So RMPP handle the initial enquiry and pass it on to RMSPS (capita for NRA60) if you are in service and then deal with NRA 65.
So I have told them I will make sure pensions are in payment, before I hand my notice in.
If you have left Royal Mail, it appears that you have to apply separately to both RMPP and Capita?
I guess that is why, in the phone options, if you state you haven't left RM, you are directed to RMPP.
Let's hope they get it to me by November.

[TheStrangler]

You shouldn't have any problem with that Stephen.
I originally asked for a quote (payment date mid April) early January.
Took 3 weeks to receive the Rmpp quote and a week later the quote from capita.
I actually held on to these for some time as I just wanted the quotes to give me an idea of the minimum I could get.
I actually posted the forms confirming I wanted to take them just after the original payment date in mid April, leaving the date on there as it was and still expecting it to take months to get processed, especially as they originally said because of cov19 there was no point in sending it for another month!
Anyway, I don't know whether it was because the original payment date had passed, but they processed it and simply revised the payment date to end of June and adjusted the figures from the original quote.
I'm just about to send my options out now for payment at end of June.
I've no idea if they'll both pay out simultaneously or I might have to chase up capita but will update on here in any case.

[stephen500]

You shouldn't have any problem with that Stephen.
I originally asked for a quote (payment date mid April) early January.
Took 3 weeks to receive the Rmpp quote and a week later the quote from capita.
I actually held on to these for some time as I just wanted the quotes to give me an idea of the minimum I could get.
I actually posted the forms confirming I wanted to take them just after the original payment date in mid April, leaving the date on there as it was and still expecting it to take months to get processed, especially as they originally said because of cov19 there was no point in sending it for another month!
Anyway, I don't know whether it was because the original payment date had passed, but they processed it and simply revised the payment date to end of June and adjusted the figures from the original quote.
I'm just about to send my options out now for payment at end of June.
I've no idea if they'll both pay out simultaneously or I might have to chase up capita but will update on here in any case.

Thanks.
I wait now for my quote and hope it will be in the ball park figures I have worked out.
I don't think it will be a lot different.
New workings out:
NRA 60 yearly pension incl (2008-2010) after 16% reduction for max LS (15%)and 2 mths early (1%) £8838.98
NRA 65 yearly pension (deducting 2008-10) and 26% deduction for 5 yrs 2 mths early payment £2218.52
Total yearly pension £11,057.80
lump sums
NRA 60 (incl 2008-10) £58921 max LS
NRA 65 (deducting 2008-10) £6656.46 min LS
DBCBS (non taxable) £6101.54
Total tax free (25%) £12758 = what would have been my max lump sum
Excess taxable DBCBS £3941.34 (after tax at 20% which would be £985.34)
Total Lump sums £75620.31
Let's hope my quote comes in the same!
For your info
Section B
Pensionable pay 2019 = £28,833
DBCBS pensionable pay 2019 £29,203
Full night allowance (reserved rights PHG)
FS service 27 years and 42 days
Csdb service blocks =10 (2 will be assigned to NRA60) 2008-10
Cash balance service 31st march 2019, 31st march 2020 and Oct end 2020 = 2 years and 7 months £5724 x 2 + £5906 minus 5 months (=£3445) = £14898 minus 26% for early payment = £11,020.82

[mr hil.]

I didn't think there was as much of a reduction for the cash balance scheme. After all it is merely a pot of cash to be paid when you retire. An adjustment would be made but not the full 5% per year as happens with the other benefits we have when requested early.

[RobertT]

There's been some debate on this forum as to whether the DBCBS is reduced or not. The general consensus seems to be that it either isn't reduced, or it is but only by a small amount. Although the RMPP website does state:

After you’ve reached 55, your employer may allow you to choose early retirement.

If you do retire early, your benefits will be calculated based on what you have built up at the date of leaving. Your pension and lump sum (including your Cash Balance fund) will be reduced because they’re being paid early.

[Steve_claret]

If you are due your NRA60 or NRA65 pensions by reaching those ages then the PSC (RMPP) send an electronic order to Capita to commence the process. The RMPP won't send their estimates out to you until Capita have confirmed that they have sent you theirs first. It's a very messy arrangement which can very easily go wrong resulting in delays in payment but unfortunately it is the outcome of having two different pension administrators.

[stephen500]

I didn't think there was as much of a reduction for the cash balance scheme. After all it is merely a pot of cash to be paid when you retire. An adjustment would be made but not the full 5% per year as happens with the other benefits we have when requested early.

No body knows what the reduction for taking the DBCBS early is, I have just factored that in as a worse case. The union Trustee I spoke too, seems to think there will be a reduction, but he did not know how much?

[stephen500]

If you are due your NRA60 or NRA65 pensions by reaching those ages then the PSC (RMPP) send an electronic order to Capita to commence the process. The RMPP won't send their estimates out to you until Capita have confirmed that they have sent you theirs first. It's a very messy arrangement which can very easily go wrong resulting in delays in payment but unfortunately it is the outcome of having two different pension administrators.

I will give it the 3 weeks to a month that they said the quotes should be with me by, before I start to chase the process. So that is the end of this month. Nov is my target payment date.

[stephen500]

Latest update from RMPP

pensions.jpg

[stephen500]

Received quotes from RMSPS today dated 10th June 2020.
These relate to benefits payable by Capita (RMSPS)
One question to Robert T (please)
Why do they say this quote relates to benefits up to 31st March 2012.
When the CSDB scheme started in 2008.
I knew they took up to 2010 and I expected 2 years from 2008-2010 to be included in the quote.
Where does 2012 fit in?
-------------------
As for the quotes
I estimated my NRA 60 and NRA65 (RMSPS only) (incl 2008-2010?) to be about £8838.98 annual pension
whereas it is £10,096.87
I expected my max lump sum NRA 60 and NRA65 (RMSPS only) to be £58921
Whereas it is £67312.06 (an extra £8391 more than I expected) and a pension of £1200 more than I expected.
I enclose slides.
I await my RMPP quotes for their part of NRA65 incl incorporated DBCBS.
I am not sure of the effect on these, with my estimates as RMSPS say they go up to 31st March 2012, when I was expecting 2010?? (Robert T?)
Still, I still expect both pensions and lump sums to be above my estimates.
I await my 2nd quote from RMPP.
after that we return forms and await the money!

pen 1.jpg

pen 2.jpg

pen 3.jpg

next NR65 slide on next reply

[stephen500]

pen 4.jpg

NRA 65 cont

[RobertT]

The RMSPS relates to benefits accrued up to 31st March 2012 and is paid by the government/taxpayer, so that includes:

Final salary pension up to 31st March 2008
CSDB from 1st April 2008 to 31st March 2012.

The RMPP relates to benefits accrued from 1st April 2012, including the DBCBS.

But your benefits will be paid out on a NRA60 & NRA65 basis:

NRA60 = all benefits accrued up to 31st March 2010, which includes all final salary pension and the first 2 years of CSDB.
NRA65 = all benefits accrued from 1st April 2010 to 31st March 2018, plus the DBCBS.

Hence your RMSPS figures are higher than you thought and your RMPP figures will be lower.