RMCtv : CEO Simon Thompson has exchanged further letters with the CWU's Dave Ward this evening. You can read Simon's latest letter here, with talks planned tomorrow in front of Acas.

[Rommagic]

Still talking still on strike on Friday.

[Halfhappy]

I am no longer a Labour Party member & don’t particularly like KS but I sort of understand the game he is playing. If he veers too far to the Left he will be hammered ,a-la Corbyn,by the Tory biased press & the Cons themselves. Things may be changing with the state of the country & the absolute clusterfuck the Tories have got us into,but history tells us that,on the whole,the working class of this country do not want a socialist government- and as a self proclaimed ‘Lefty’ - I type that with a heavy heart…

The irony, sorry I mean tragedy, is people are overwhelming in favour of socialist policies. There's just so much effort been put into demonising of the word 'Socialist", and it's proponents.

Socialism has never worked and never will.
Imagine wanting the Government to own everything including your own thoughts.

That's not socialism, that's totalitarianism. This is exactly the problem.

[milly]

I am no longer a Labour Party member & don’t particularly like KS but I sort of understand the game he is playing. If he veers too far to the Left he will be hammered ,a-la Corbyn,by the Tory biased press & the Cons themselves. Things may be changing with the state of the country & the absolute clusterfuck the Tories have got us into,but history tells us that,on the whole,the working class of this country do not want a socialist government- and as a self proclaimed ‘Lefty’ - I type that with a heavy heart…

The irony, sorry I mean tragedy, is people are overwhelming in favour of socialist policies. There's just so much effort been put into demonising of the word 'Socialist", and it's proponents.

Socialism has never worked and never will.
Imagine wanting the Government to own everything including your own thoughts.

That's not socialism, that's totalitarianism. This is exactly the problem.

Under Socialism a different set of corrupt Politicians would still have far too much control over our lives.

[Thailand1]

This about Simon Thompson & CWU not a party political broadcast....Please can we stick to topic?

[Corey]

So, would that mean the £365 loss in an overestimate? I was going to mention the withdrawal of the cross-subsidy.

Yes because GLS are still on course to make a profit. (But as you state they no longer want to use GLS profits to subsidise RM.)
I don't know what the last estimate for RM (or Parcelforce) was (possibly break-even) but it will have been downgraded due to the ongoing IA.

Somewhere on here Ward is quoted as saying that ST told the shareholders the business will be bankrupt in January.

I think what shouldn’t go unsaid is that GLS was bought by Royal Mail , not the other way round , and long before we were privatised .

What shouldn't be forgotten is that all the money invested in GLS and their infrastructure including the building of the Super Duper Hubs has been taken out of Royal Mail's Groups profits as a whole so effectively Royal Mail have cross subsidised what was a fledgling new to the industry business. Yet as it is now turning a profit they want to pretend it is a separate organisation

Kind of the point I was trying to make , GLS would have benefited greatly over the years from RM money and investment, yet Simon and his cronies are now at great pains to make it not work the other way .

[Halfhappy]

I am no longer a Labour Party member & don’t particularly like KS but I sort of understand the game he is playing. If he veers too far to the Left he will be hammered ,a-la Corbyn,by the Tory biased press & the Cons themselves. Things may be changing with the state of the country & the absolute clusterfuck the Tories have got us into,but history tells us that,on the whole,the working class of this country do not want a socialist government- and as a self proclaimed ‘Lefty’ - I type that with a heavy heart…

The irony, sorry I mean tragedy, is people are overwhelming in favour of socialist policies. There's just so much effort been put into demonising of the word 'Socialist", and it's proponents.

Socialism has never worked and never will.
Imagine wanting the Government to own everything including your own thoughts.

That's not socialism, that's totalitarianism. This is exactly the problem.

Under Socialism a different set of corrupt Politicians would still have far too much control over our lives.

Last thing I'll say on it, as the sheer ignorance of it needs a response. You're completely misunderstanding. Control of everything, by the state, is totalitarianism, not socialism. At present we have a system that privatises profit, and nationalises debt. The beloved NHS was, I say was, an example of socialism. Total ignorance of all this is why we're on here bickering over the words of a millionaire CEO who's simply trying to destroy a union, cos unions are the only thing in the way of him, and his ilk getting richer, and our lives getting worse.

[Halfhappy]

So, would that mean the £365 loss in an overestimate? I was going to mention the withdrawal of the cross-subsidy.

Yes because GLS are still on course to make a profit. (But as you state they no longer want to use GLS profits to subsidise RM.)
I don't know what the last estimate for RM (or Parcelforce) was (possibly break-even) but it will have been downgraded due to the ongoing IA.

Somewhere on here Ward is quoted as saying that ST told the shareholders the business will be bankrupt in January.

I think what shouldn’t go unsaid is that GLS was bought by Royal Mail , not the other way round , and long before we were privatised .

What shouldn't be forgotten is that all the money invested in GLS and their infrastructure including the building of the Super Duper Hubs has been taken out of Royal Mail's Groups profits as a whole so effectively Royal Mail have cross subsidised what was a fledgling new to the industry business. Yet as it is now turning a profit they want to pretend it is a separate organisation

Kind of the point I was trying to make , GLS would have benefited greatly over the years from RM money and investment, yet Simon and his cronies are now at great pains to make it not work the other way .

That is exactly the point. It's corporate socialism. Privatise profit, nationalise debt.

[Halfhappy]

This about Simon Thompson & CWU not a party political broadcast....Please can we stick to topic?

I understand this isn't a thread about political systems, but I don't think it hurts for people to talk and engage in politics. It has to be better than people just sitting thinking all systems are the same and all politicians are the same.

[clashcityrocker]

Kind of the point I was trying to make, GLS would have benefited greatly over the years from RM money and investment, yet Simon and his cronies are now at great pains to make it not work the other way.

GLS also benefitted by having Rico Back in charge and not having its workers on the same terms and conditions as its UK counterparts.
Why, as trade unionists, would we want to be subsidised by what is touted to be a terrible business model?

[postslippete]

The letter by Simon is massively condescending


He patronises posties who have lost nearly £1k due to the strikes and then ends talking about co-ordinating comms on how to prevent further escalation to ensure that posties can come into work safely.

Surely if he was that concerned on preventing further escalation he would put an end to picket lines altogether and agree a deal.


Lets not forget also who caused the dispute in the first place. Was it the CWU and the posties with their 99% mandate for strike action or an incompetent CEO who decided to rip up the Pathway to Change agreement after giving away most of "group" profits to shareholders and award themselves huge bonuses in return?

[Halfhappy]

Kind of the point I was trying to make, GLS would have benefited greatly over the years from RM money and investment, yet Simon and his cronies are now at great pains to make it not work the other way.

GLS also benefitted by having Rico Back in charge and not having its workers on the same terms and conditions as its UK counterparts.
Why, as trade unionists, would we want to be subsidised by what is touted to be a terrible business model?

This is true. It's barely ever mentioned. Are GLS unionised?

[Corey]

Kind of the point I was trying to make, GLS would have benefited greatly over the years from RM money and investment, yet Simon and his cronies are now at great pains to make it not work the other way.

GLS also benefitted by having Rico Back in charge and not having its workers on the same terms and conditions as its UK counterparts.
Why, as trade unionists, would we want to be subsidised by what is touted to be a terrible business model?

I don’t disagree, in an ideal world GLS workers should have decent terms and conditions, unfortunately the board obviously want us to have GLS terms and conditions ( namely none ) whether it is right to be subsidised by that company is a bit like saying should Saudi Arabians own a British football team , and that’s a whole other argument.

[postslippete]

This is true. It's barely ever mentioned. Are GLS unionised?

Don't think so. But they have been busy in the past taking over companies in Europe and as far away as California and Canada. In Italy, there were strikes in 2016 against GLS and its subcontractors over poor working conditions. According to GLS on wiki :

In mid-September 2016, hundreds of parcel delivery workers took strike action in Italian cities of Bergamo, Brescia, Piacenza, Bologna and Parma against GLS and its subcontractors to protest against poor working conditions. On the night of 14–15 September 2016, a van broke through a picket line formed by workers in front of the plant operated by GLS subcontractor SEAM in Piacenza. The van struck and killed Egyptian worker Abd Elsalam Ahmed Eldanf. It was reported that eyewitnesses heard the plant's Chief of Staff ordering the driver to break through the picket line.[16] The Piacenza Prosecutor's office concluded that no strike or protest was taking place at that moment and therefore ruled the death was a car accident. The driver was subsequently released, prompting 7,000 workers to take to the streets in Piacenza and at other GLS offices in Italy, as well as from other firms.[16][17]

[stan_lers]

Under Socialism a different set of corrupt Politicians would still have far too much control over our lives.

This is exactly the propaganda you and the rest of us have been fed for over a century.

"Well the other side are no better".

You've been told that socialist politicians are no better and are still as corrupt but this has been the most corrupt government probably in UK history. The right wing press want you to think that Labour are just as bad - with no proof or examples - because you'll either vote Tory again, or you won't vote at all, which is the same thing.

One side wants you to have rights and fair pay and a public sector that looks out for everyone and the other side takes money that you pay through tax and gives it to billionaires. If you, as a postal worker, think that the party that has created this entire mess is no worse than the opposition then you're one of millions of examples of why politics is so broken in this country. You are actively poorer and more exploited because of one party and you'll brush off the poor and disabled people literally starving to death, the kids with scurvy, the food banks, the corruption, the biggest transfer of wealth from the poor to the rich in history by saying "yeah yeah but Labour would be just as bad".

[sindba]

The saddest thing about this country is how many working / less well off people have been brainwashed into supporting things that are *directly* against their own interests. Whether it's Brexit, voting Tory, punching down at refugees or the unemployed etc.

And the saddest thing is that the rich and powerful people who have been doing the brainwashing - from Murdoch to Rothermere to Farage - think you are scum. They don't even pity you for supporting their worldview, they laugh at how pathetic you are.