LTB 127/20 - SICK ABSENCE DUE TO CORONAVIRUS - COVID 19 : Royal Mail "Vast majority of coronavirus absences to be discounted from the normal attendance procedure"

Post by **POSTMAN** » 16 Mar 2020, 16:55

POSTMAN EDIT MARCH 2022:
As we are now living with covid, this no doubt from March/April will be defunked from ongoing Covid absences.
Left this here for reference, especially with all those stage warnings coming up.

https://www.cwu.org/ltb/ltb-127-20-sick ... -covid-19/

No. 127/2020

16th March 2020

TO: ALL BRANCHES WITH POSTAL MEMBERS

Dear Colleagues

RE: SICK ABSENCE DUE TO CORONAVIRUS – COVID 19

The department wrote to Royal Mail on 9th March to discuss assurances around what will happen in the event of members having to self-isolate due to coronavirus. A response was received on 12th March and a meeting took place on 13th March 2020. A further discussion has taken place today.

Whilst advice will change on a regular basis going forward around self-isolation, we wanted to ensure members are not put in a position where they could be faced with the decision to come to work and risk spreading the virus or taking the proper medical advice and stay at home. A major part of the decision making process in the above scenario will be whether they can afford to stay at home and also have the security of knowing they will not be have the absence counted under the Attendance Agreement.

We welcome the sick pay being paid to members within their first year of employment and see this as a positive way forward. This was confirmed in Royal Mail’s Communication sent out on Friday 13th March 2020. This is attached at Appendix A.

We have also spoken to Royal Mail about discounting absences within the Attendance Agreement relating to coronavirus. Royal Mail’s response to discounting absence due to coronavirus is below.

Will absences due to coronavirus be counted within the attendance procedure?

Answer: We would expect the vast majority of coronavirus absences to be discounted from the normal attendance procedure. However, in the event coronavirus absences are for an excessive duration or repeat in nature further investigation may be required.

Where members have to take time off to look after dependents they will be able to take annual leave, unpaid time off or be able to work flexibly.
These terms apply to everyone within Royal Mail group, including RMPFS members. Parcelforce have similar arrangements in place, through a separate communication.

All enquiries regarding the content of this LTB should be addressed to the PTCS Department, quoting reference 415. Email address: khay@cwu.org

Yours Sincerely,

Carl Maden

Assistant Secretary (Acting)

Coronavirus Manager’s Update

Update 30 March

What do managers need to do if a coronavirus related absence prompts an Attendance Review 1 or 2 or Consideration of Dismissal?

Where an Attendance Review 1 or 2 or Consideration of Dismissal has been prompted due to coronavirus related sick absence, managers should consider if there is a need to meet with the employee, given the advice that in most cases coronavirus absences are discounted from the normal attendance procedure.

If a manager decides they do need to meet with the employee, for example the absence was excessive in nature or there were repeat absences, they should invite the employee to the relevant attendance meeting using the available invitation letters and ensuring that when meeting they follow the social distancing guidelines that have been communicated.

Managers should seek guidance form HR Services Advice & Support if they are considering issuing an AR1/AR2 or considering dismissing an employee due to a coronavirus related absence. Please see the manager guide on managing coronavirus related absence for further information.

Do managers still need to hold welcome back meetings when employees return from coronavirus related sick absence?

Managers should continue to hold welcome back meetings, but ensure they follow the current advice on increasing social distancing if they are meeting with the employee.
Please see the manager guide on managing coronavirus related absence for further information. (https://www.myroyalmail.com/sites/defau ... 062020.pdf" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;)

I have recorded an employee on PSP as a confirmed Coronavirus case. The system has prompted me to raise an OH referral. Do I need to?

You do not have to submit an OH referral for a confirmed Coronavirus case. However, if the absence exceeds expected timescales or a return to work cannot be agreed, a referral may support you to understand your employee’s situation and/or highlight what adjustments can be made to support their return to work. Updated : 8 Oct

2nd post PDF in the Global Announcement...
viewtopic.php?f=71&t=94715" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

chickenwittle · Post by **chickenwittle** » 16 Mar 2020, 17:55

If a family member shows symptoms we are now being told to self isolate for 14 days by the government.Why should I have to take annual leave or unpaid leave for that ?Sorry Royal Mail that’s not good enough.

LaggyBand · Post by **LaggyBand** » 16 Mar 2020, 17:57

So basically if you’re on a stage 3 then you’ll still be worried by this purposely grey language and you’d probably still go to work as a result.

Woody Guthrie · Post by **Woody Guthrie** » 16 Mar 2020, 18:04

chickenwittle wrote:If a family member shows symptoms we are now being told to self isolate for 14 days by the government.Why should I have to take annual leave or unpaid leave for that ?Sorry Royal Mail that’s not good enough.

You don't.
If a family member shows symptoms you have to self isolate as well.
That's not the same as caring for dependants.

Post by **POSTMAN** » 16 Mar 2020, 18:04

LaggyBand wrote:So basically if you’re on a stage 3 then you’ll still be worried by this purposely grey language and you’d probably still go to work as a result.

No, why would you, it's in the red text. You get it...you go off.

Post by **POSTMAN** » 16 Mar 2020, 18:10

Woody Guthrie wrote:
chickenwittle wrote:If a family member shows symptoms we are now being told to self isolate for 14 days by the government.Why should I have to take annual leave or unpaid leave for that ?Sorry Royal Mail that’s not good enough.

You don't.
If a family member shows symptoms you have to self isolate as well.
That's not the same as caring for dependants.

What's the situation on pay (or is there none) because of self-isolation I can't find it anywhere?

Woody Guthrie · Post by **Woody Guthrie** » 16 Mar 2020, 18:23

POSTMAN wrote:
Woody Guthrie wrote:
chickenwittle wrote:If a family member shows symptoms we are now being told to self isolate for 14 days by the government.Why should I have to take annual leave or unpaid leave for that ?Sorry Royal Mail that’s not good enough.

You don't.
If a family member shows symptoms you have to self isolate as well.
That's not the same as caring for dependants.
What's the situation on pay (or is there none) because of self-isolation I can't find it anywhere?

From the managers brief...

3. Recording coronavirus related absences in PSP
 All coronavirus absence cases should be coded as sickness absence by managers using the

appropriate code in PSP:
o Coronavirus self-isolation (employees without symptoms who cannot work from home)
o Coronavirus symptoms
o Coronavirus confirmed case

Post by **POSTMAN** » 16 Mar 2020, 18:29

Woody Guthrie wrote:
POSTMAN wrote:
Woody Guthrie wrote:
chickenwittle wrote:If a family member shows symptoms we are now being told to self isolate for 14 days by the government.Why should I have to take annual leave or unpaid leave for that ?Sorry Royal Mail that’s not good enough.

You don't.
If a family member shows symptoms you have to self isolate as well.
That's not the same as caring for dependants.
What's the situation on pay (or is there none) because of self-isolation I can't find it anywhere?

From the managers brief...

3. Recording coronavirus related absences in PSP
 All coronavirus absence cases should be coded as sickness absence by managers using the

appropriate code in PSP:
o Coronavirus self-isolation (employees without symptoms who cannot work from home)
o Coronavirus symptoms
o Coronavirus confirmed case

Cheers, can you send me the brief please, I think I need to do a what we know so far type of post to put all things in one place.
Ta

Zicomurphy · Post by **Zicomurphy** » 16 Mar 2020, 18:29

POSTMAN wrote:
Woody Guthrie wrote:
chickenwittle wrote:If a family member shows symptoms we are now being told to self isolate for 14 days by the government.Why should I have to take annual leave or unpaid leave for that ?Sorry Royal Mail that’s not good enough.

You don't.
If a family member shows symptoms you have to self isolate as well.
That's not the same as caring for dependants.
What's the situation on pay (or is there none) because of self-isolation I can't find it anywhere?

I assume would be counted as sick pay so if you normally receive full pay when off sick you would receive full pay. Would also assume it would count towards the 6 months full pay/6 months half pay in a 4 year period sick pay policy.

Glad to see an agreed policy on this now in regard to stage warnings and time off caring for others and it does seem very reasonable as long as its implemented properly.

Woody Guthrie · Post by **Woody Guthrie** » 16 Mar 2020, 18:31

You got a fever Susan?
It's attached to the LTB up top.

Post by **POSTMAN** » 16 Mar 2020, 18:37

Woody Guthrie wrote:You got a fever Susan?
It's attached to the LTB up top.

I genuinely can't find the bit you quoted

But I'll use your quote anyway no worries.
xx

Woody Guthrie · Post by **Woody Guthrie** » 16 Mar 2020, 18:54

Absences of more than seven days: We understand that there may be delays in getting NHS 111 certification for absences over 7 days.

If an employee receives guidance that they should self-isolate for more than seven days, they will need to provide details of who provided the advice.

That's an easy one.
Alexander Boris de Pfeffel Johnson.

'We need to ask you to ensure that if you or anyone in your household has one of those two symptoms, then you should stay at home for fourteen days.'"

EdRush · Post by **EdRush** » 16 Mar 2020, 20:05

Even if you have recovered from covid-19 it is unclear whether you can be reinfected, or relapse.

Japan and China have both reported multiple cases of people testing positive after recovering.

ssdd · Post by **ssdd** » 16 Mar 2020, 20:12

EdRush wrote:Even if you have recovered from covid-19 it is unclear whether you can be reinfected, or relapse.

Japan and China have both reported multiple cases of people testing positive after recovering.

And you may be infecting people before you even show symptoms:
https://www.cnn.com/2020/03/14/health/c ... index.html

EdRush · Post by **EdRush** » 16 Mar 2020, 20:23

ssdd wrote:
EdRush wrote:Even if you have recovered from covid-19 it is unclear whether you can be reinfected, or relapse.

Japan and China have both reported multiple cases of people testing positive after recovering.
And you may be infecting people before you even show symptoms:
https://www.cnn.com/2020/03/14/health/c ... index.html

So Royal Mail's answer is just a typical double edged sword, scaremongering employees into Presenteeism