Prediction

Post by **rogersh** » 16 Nov 2019, 19:09

1. CWU lose appeal.
2. While re-ballot is announced Royal Mail will offer to agree the shorter working week backdated to October 2019 which will mean back-pay for both part & full timers.

The managers had their Christmas bonus stopped & then voted in favour when offered a bonus to help secure an agreement to their dispute. (So they received some of what they were due originally)
Perhaps it is not too much of a leap to assume RM will offer CWU members a similar financial incentive which was part of the original 4 pillars agreement.

Hope I am wrong on appeal decision.

Gasman11 · Post by **Gasman11** » 16 Nov 2019, 19:16

Wouldnt write off the appeal just yet, thought that suggestion from the CWU live fb presentation on Thursday was interesting ie they are considering compiling a petition type document open to everyone who voted along the lines of "Did you submit your vote voluntarily, without undue pressure etc".

Would be an interesting submission if it hit the 85,000 signatures mark.

yellowbelly · Post by **yellowbelly** » 16 Nov 2019, 22:26

Gasman11 wrote:Wouldnt write off the appeal just yet, thought that suggestion from the CWU live fb presentation on Thursday was interesting ie they are considering compiling a petition type document open to everyone who voted along the lines of "Did you submit your vote voluntarily, without undue pressure etc".

Would be an interesting submission if it hit the 85,000 signatures mark.

RM would be on the floor laughing their proverbials off.....

So you would get all union members to sign a petition which would be presented to you by a rep and let's say it's a piece or individual pieces of A4 paper
with your name, address etc on it and then other people would see your details on it when they signed it, all to say
you didn't suffer undue pressure when voting - don't you see the irony there.....wouldn't a second, correctly conducted postal ballot
without all the social media 'Look at us' crap be easier? And if there were less than 100% of the numbers on the petition of the figure that voted
for IA action, how would/could that be interpreted - that 500 people DID suffer undue pressure?

Gasman11 · Post by **Gasman11** » 17 Nov 2019, 00:18

It was a suggestion and i very much doubt it would involve scraps of paper, perhaps more likely to be an online type exercise resembling those HoC debate petitions. Anyway it was in the context of appealling against Wednesdays judgement as the important point is CWU have to test their case again.

Post by **britwrit** » 17 Nov 2019, 08:34

yellowbelly wrote:
Gasman11 wrote:Wouldnt write off the appeal just yet, thought that suggestion from the CWU live fb presentation on Thursday was interesting ie they are considering compiling a petition type document open to everyone who voted along the lines of "Did you submit your vote voluntarily, without undue pressure etc".

Would be an interesting submission if it hit the 85,000 signatures mark.
RM would be on the floor laughing their proverbials off.....

So you would get all union members to sign a petition which would be presented to you by a rep and let's say it's a piece or individual pieces of A4 paper
with your name, address etc on it and then other people would see your details on it when they signed it, all to say
you didn't suffer undue pressure when voting - don't you see the irony there.....wouldn't a second, correctly conducted postal ballot
without all the social media 'Look at us' crap be easier? And if there were less than 100% of the numbers on the petition of the figure that voted
for IA action, how would/could that be interpreted - that 500 people DID suffer undue pressure?

Next ballot, why don't we just have an American-style pep rally on every shop floor in Royal Mail, complete with marching band and cheer squads?

If we're going to make the same mistake again, let's do it with flair and style.

GT85 · Post by **GT85** » 17 Nov 2019, 09:50

I see the appeal as more of a testing of just how far the anti union/ strike laws are prepared to go rather than geting a good result.

Did I hear correctly that the appeal court has 3 judges instead of one and they are of a higher level ?

If it was the general election postal votes that tipped the original decision against us the government are surly recognising how important that the postal service is ?

How about CWU free to strike anytime after the 12 th Dec when all the political bshit has been delivered and we go back to being lazy, thieving, overpaid pizza leaflet delivery people (as I read in a newspaper comments section )

Why are the media not asking who this Rico Back bloke is and why is he not showing his face in all of this ?

Acca Dacca · Post by **Acca Dacca** » 17 Nov 2019, 10:42

A petition is one of the worst ideas I have ever heard

Chelseablue · Post by **Chelseablue** » 17 Nov 2019, 10:56

The media coverage has been non existent ! Nothing about what reeeeeco back is getting up to etc. The service is and has been a joke since privitisation . Never known so much cut offs this early in offices, wont get highlited as it gets cleared up by the same ppl all the time. Fatcats getting fatter while the service gets worse !

Woody Guthrie · Post by **Woody Guthrie** » 17 Nov 2019, 11:11

My prediction is the business will offer the union a face saving but ultimately meaningless gesture, perhaps around the SWW and dropping a potential damages case.

If I were CWU HQ I would bite their hand off, the union through its own hubris has dumped us deep in the s**t and rather than trying to blame everyone and anyone to cover their own mistakes they should be trying to limit the damage done.

awesomepenguin · Post by **awesomepenguin** » 17 Nov 2019, 11:20

Petitions hold absolutely no sway in legal matters in a law court.

barcajr · Post by **barcajr** » 17 Nov 2019, 14:13

Instead of blaming the judge or "the establishment", how about blaming those who thought it would be a good idea to publish pictures on social media of members taking voting slips out of the normal mail and filling them. Had the voting slips been for a parliamentary election they would have been arrested for electrol fraud

NewPostieUK · Post by **NewPostieUK** » 17 Nov 2019, 14:37

rogersh wrote: 2. While re-ballot is announced Royal Mail will offer to agree the shorter working week backdated to October 2019 which will mean back-pay for both part & full timers.

The managers had their Christmas bonus stopped & then voted in favour when offered a bonus to help secure an agreement to their dispute. (So they received some of what they were due originally)
Perhaps it is not too much of a leap to assume RM will offer CWU members a similar financial incentive which was part of the original 4 pillars agreement.

The hour reduction in the Four Pillars was dependant on savings being made to pay for it. That was never going to happen.
For them to take away this self-funding bit would cost them a fortune. They would end up giving us something way better than what was in the Four Pillars.

However, I agree it wouldn't be surprising if they came up with some kind of bribe that would seriously affect any future vote.

The union needs to start now warning us (the workforce) not to be influenced by talk of bribes such as a short term pittance back dated to whenever.

postslippete · Post by **postslippete** » 17 Nov 2019, 22:00

I bet Royal Mail are busy drafting up loads of proposed changes that they will want to introduce. They did this last time remember - things like franchising the walks or maybe they will want its workers to do away with meal reliefs and paid breaks this time, like they have introduced at ASDA - in response to the CWUs SWW idea perhaps??

If parcels are the future and RM obviously have the investment to introduce these large parcel hubs - what will the Union accept for this to happen? An investment in its postal workers perhaps? Would ParcelForce be better organised if it ran as a separate entity?

Dorset Plodder · Post by **Dorset Plodder** » 18 Nov 2019, 10:41

I'm sure Royal Mail will put up some Bullshit Proposals with the offer of some cash, if we sign off on it

I know a lot of the Dickheads in my DO would probably go for a quick Bung.

I believe the appropriate sum is Thirty Pieces of Silver!

Celgar · Post by **Celgar** » 18 Nov 2019, 19:50

I find it a little scary that so many posties are purely concerned with the SWW even in my DO where we are mostly full time with a few on four full days. It may be that the media is putting out the usual line about us wanting more pay but the union just harping on about the SWW backs up the media information. Without union staff letting us know what is really going on via this site we would have no idea and would be in dark like most other posties.
Previous to the strike being stopped in it's tracks it was being predicted that we would get the SWW & four pillars reinstated, for what they are worth, but the other major wrecking changes to the business would go ahead. This prediction seemed correct at the time & it feels even more the case now. In nearly every dispute over the past twenty years we have been sold out or accepted a bad deal. We are on course for this to continue but on a monumental scale compared to before.