What will a Strike achieve?

[ssdd]

Problem is Rico is 66 years old all ready made his millions,he does'nt care about us just his targets and his ego to get his own way.
But if we dont strike we will never know,best we cant hope for is a watered down version of the management plans.

Agreed, but hopefully we can achieve this with another massive yes vote, without having to strike.

[leemg]

I hope you guys don’t mind me posting on your message board, but it will hopefully give a perspective from ‘the other side of the fence’ and help me understand a few points. I am the owner of an eCommerce company and we ship approximately 50k parcels per month. 90% of our parcels are sent by Royal Mail. I joined this forum, when industrial action (IA) looked possible before the four pillars agreement was made, so that I could keep abreast of what was happening in order to protect my business against the disruption that IA would create for us.

Firstly, I’m trying to understand why people are against the business evolving to become first and foremost a parcel business, given that Royal Mail have guaranteed any cuts will come from Voluntary Redundancy?

Secondly, given the rate of change in the industry, what do you hope to get out of the threat of IA, or indeed IA itself. I have asked with sincerity the guys that do our collections what would be a good outcome for them, and they can't give me an answer. It seems that they are leaving everything in the hands of the CWU and will accept whatever they achieve on their behalf? However, to my knowledge, the CWU has't made clear what they would agree to?

As the dispute grew and the ballot last year achieved a mandate for IA we HAD to start looking elsewhere otherwise our business would very likely have been adversely affected had it gone ahead. Fortunately for us it didn’t, and we delayed the implementation and integration of Hermes until after Christmas to get an idea of which way things were going to go.

Of course, my preferred choice of supplier is Royal Mail, but as soon as the re-ballot was announced we were effectively forced to move a large portion of our shipments to Hermes so that IF IA is taken, we can simply channel all of our business through them. We are now in contract with Hermes for 12 months, so no matter what happens Royal Mail have lost a large portion of our business. If IA does go ahead then we will move the rest.

Please understand that my questions and comments are genuine. Perhaps there is some things that I have missed or not privy too. I also understand that ultimately, we look out for number 1, just as we have had too do. But I'm really interested to understand what people consider a win, and how IA will achieve it?

Thanks, Lee

[LaggyBand]

If we do not strike, then the business will move forward on the new premise that engaging the union / workers is not necessary.

If we do not strike, change will be brought in by force rather than collaboratively.

If we do not strike, it means agreements between the employer and employees do not mean anything and cannot be relied upon.

We are threatening to strike because the board and the union are at loggerheads.

The reason why is because they have different visions for the RM brand of the future. One is cheap cheap labour with little union involvement (which is seen as unnecessary cost and delay) to compete against Hermes / Yodel.

The other is a premium brand competing against DPD / UPS, with an expanded public role to that which we have now. I know which I’d rather work for.

Edit: also, if we did not threaten strike a few years ago, we’d be on route ownership and not employees. So I’ll add another:

The past tells us that if we do not threaten to strike, we’d be worse off.

[2yearpostie]

I hope you guys don’t mind me posting on your message board, but it will hopefully give a perspective from ‘the other side of the fence’ and help me understand a few points. I am the owner of an eCommerce company and we ship approximately 50k parcels per month. 90% of our parcels are sent by Royal Mail. I joined this forum, when industrial action (IA) looked possible before the four pillars agreement was made, so that I could keep abreast of what was happening in order to protect my business against the disruption that IA would create for us.

Firstly, I’m trying to understand why people are against the business evolving to become first and foremost a parcel business, given that Royal Mail have guaranteed any cuts will come from Voluntary Redundancy?

Secondly, given the rate of change in the industry, what do you hope to get out of the threat of IA, or indeed IA itself. I have asked with sincerity the guys that do our collections what would be a good outcome for them, and they can't give me an answer. It seems that they are leaving everything in the hands of the CWU and will accept whatever they achieve on their behalf? However, to my knowledge, the CWU has't made clear what they would agree to?

As the dispute grew and the ballot last year achieved a mandate for IA we HAD to start looking elsewhere otherwise our business would very likely have been adversely affected had it gone ahead. Fortunately for us it didn’t, and we delayed the implementation and integration of Hermes until after Christmas to get an idea of which way things were going to go.

Of course, my preferred choice of supplier is Royal Mail, but as soon as the re-ballot was announced we were effectively forced to move a large portion of our shipments to Hermes so that IF IA is taken, we can simply channel all of our business through them. We are now in contract with Hermes for 12 months, so no matter what happens Royal Mail have lost a large portion of our business. If IA does go ahead then we will move the rest.

Please understand that my questions and comments are genuine. Perhaps there is some things that I have missed or not privy too. I also understand that ultimately, we look out for number 1, just as we have had too do. But I'm really interested to understand what people consider a win, and how IA will achieve it?

Thanks, Lee

Its because we are going to get unachievable levels of work, and as proud workers we dont want the customers to have to accept that.

For example, most of the parcels you send will only be delivered by around 300 offices instead of the current 1400. They will be done between 1pm and 7pm and if your customers arent in we wont be able to leave them at the nearest delivery office or post office as they will be closed when we finish. They will need to go back to the delivery office that ' parcel postie' is operating from (lat hub) which could be up to 40 miles away from the recipient, forcing your customers into an 80 mile round trip if they arent in when we call to collect the parcel, hardly ideal is it!

[Ren Hoëk]

If the strike is sustained the chances of them ever coming back diminishes.

And who is that going to hurt the most?
Rico? Who we are continually told has no attachment to this great institution and probably won't stay for long anyway.
Or the people who rely on this job to pay their mortgage and feed their kids? (And for some on a 25 hour contract it doesn't even do that)

Is the new mantra - let's lose work to save our jobs? (Doublethink at its purest)

You're right. Lets do nothing Every strike, Ever, the ultimate goal is to show management that without its workers the business will fail.

[Coinbags]

"For example, most of the parcels you send will only be delivered by around 300 offices instead of the current 1400. They will be done between 1pm and 7pm and if your customers arent in we wont be able to leave them at the nearest delivery office or post office as they will be closed when we finish. They will need to go back to the delivery office that ' parcel postie' is operating from (lat hub) which could be up to 40 miles away from the recipient, forcing your customers into an 80 mile round trip if they arent in when we call to collect the parcel, hardly ideal is it!"

Rubbish - they'll go to the nearest Sub Post Office that will open until way after the Lats would finish !

[2yearpostie]

"For example, most of the parcels you send will only be delivered by around 300 offices instead of the current 1400. They will be done between 1pm and 7pm and if your customers arent in we wont be able to leave them at the nearest delivery office or post office as they will be closed when we finish. They will need to go back to the delivery office that ' parcel postie' is operating from (lat hub) which could be up to 40 miles away from the recipient, forcing your customers into an 80 mile round trip if they arent in when we call to collect the parcel, hardly ideal is it!"

Rubbish - they'll go to the nearest Sub Post Office that will open until way after the Lats would finish !

in your large cities, where i am in the small towns and rural areas of the north midlands all the post offices close at 5;30pm

[SpacePhoenix]

"For example, most of the parcels you send will only be delivered by around 300 offices instead of the current 1400. They will be done between 1pm and 7pm and if your customers arent in we wont be able to leave them at the nearest delivery office or post office as they will be closed when we finish. They will need to go back to the delivery office that ' parcel postie' is operating from (lat hub) which could be up to 40 miles away from the recipient, forcing your customers into an 80 mile round trip if they arent in when we call to collect the parcel, hardly ideal is it!"

Rubbish - they'll go to the nearest Sub Post Office that will open until way after the Lats would finish !

...and what would happen to them once they're at the sub Post Office?

[ssdd]

I hope you guys don’t mind me posting on your message board, but it will hopefully give a perspective from ‘the other side of the fence’ and help me understand a few points. I am the owner of an eCommerce company and we ship approximately 50k parcels per month. 90% of our parcels are sent by Royal Mail. I joined this forum, when industrial action (IA) looked possible before the four pillars agreement was made, so that I could keep abreast of what was happening in order to protect my business against the disruption that IA would create for us.

Firstly, I’m trying to understand why people are against the business evolving to become first and foremost a parcel business, given that Royal Mail have guaranteed any cuts will come from Voluntary Redundancy?

Secondly, given the rate of change in the industry, what do you hope to get out of the threat of IA, or indeed IA itself. I have asked with sincerity the guys that do our collections what would be a good outcome for them, and they can't give me an answer. It seems that they are leaving everything in the hands of the CWU and will accept whatever they achieve on their behalf? However, to my knowledge, the CWU has't made clear what they would agree to?

As the dispute grew and the ballot last year achieved a mandate for IA we HAD to start looking elsewhere otherwise our business would very likely have been adversely affected had it gone ahead. Fortunately for us it didn’t, and we delayed the implementation and integration of Hermes until after Christmas to get an idea of which way things were going to go.

Of course, my preferred choice of supplier is Royal Mail, but as soon as the re-ballot was announced we were effectively forced to move a large portion of our shipments to Hermes so that IF IA is taken, we can simply channel all of our business through them. We are now in contract with Hermes for 12 months, so no matter what happens Royal Mail have lost a large portion of our business. If IA does go ahead then we will move the rest.

Please understand that my questions and comments are genuine. Perhaps there is some things that I have missed or not privy too. I also understand that ultimately, we look out for number 1, just as we have had too do. But I'm really interested to understand what people consider a win, and how IA will achieve it?

Thanks, Lee

Hi Lee,

First off I would say that most employees, along with the CWU, aren't against change. We understand the business has to adapt to changing customer needs. Indeed this was recognised in the 4 pillars agreement to which plans for changing the structure of deliveries is included.

Royal Mail have not given any guarantees whatsoever. The offer which they are putting forth is conditional upon their plan being carried out at a pace which is unachievable. Also, this offer is not part of the dispute! We aren't asking for a pay rise. We want the company to work with it's employees, to plan change together. Effectively the new CEO is just forcing his ideas upon the company and not listening.

One of the main sticking points, as I see it, is how Royal Mail want to separate the delivery of large parcels and mail. The outcome of this will be workloads that are unfeasable.

I suppose a good outcome would be Royal Mail actually coming to the negotiating table and taking into consideration the wants and needs of it's employees. Starting with the 4 pillars agreement, then the plans of the CEO, and meeting somewhere in the middle.

Hope this helps, and best of luck with your business.

Oh, and by the way, I'm not a customer service representative. This is just one simple Postman's perspective.

[Bboingg]

At least I understood the Royal Mail Management offer & pay rise - clearly set out and explained.

No idea what half the CWU points of dispute or jargon on the voting form mean.

[ssdd]

At least I understood the Royal Mail Management offer & pay rise - clearly set out and explained.

No idea what half the CWU points of dispute or jargon on the voting form mean.

Really?

And did you understand that the pay offer was not part of the Dispute?

And did you understand that the offer was CONDITIONAL upon the plan being carried out?

And did you understand that when we are unable to perform to the standards they're enforcing, that any of these 'commitments', including the pay rise, will be quashed?

And did you understand that if you vote for RMs plans you wont have ANY say in what happens with your job in the future?

Apart from the pay rise not being part of the dispute, these points are also in the RM proposal 'leaflet', hidden in plain sight. You may understand the so called 'offer' from RM, but do you understand the implications of it?
A vote for RMs offer is a vote for more work, more pressure, potential for increased bullying, definite job losses, reduced terms and conditions and less ability to resolve any workplace disputes/grievances.
If that sounds good to you then vote no in the ballot....

[Coinbags]

"For example, most of the parcels you send will only be delivered by around 300 offices instead of the current 1400. They will be done between 1pm and 7pm and if your customers arent in we wont be able to leave them at the nearest delivery office or post office as they will be closed when we finish. They will need to go back to the delivery office that ' parcel postie' is operating from (lat hub) which could be up to 40 miles away from the recipient, forcing your customers into an 80 mile round trip if they arent in when we call to collect the parcel, hardly ideal is it!"

Rubbish - they'll go to the nearest Sub Post Office that will open until way after the Lats would finish !

in your large cities, where i am in the small towns and rural areas of the north midlands all the post offices close at 5;30pm

Fair comment then - Sorry !

[rogersh]

I joined this forum, when industrial action (IA) looked possible before the four pillars agreement was made, ..............

In March 2018 Moya Greene was delighted that Royal Mail had reached a ground-breaking agreement (four pillars) with the CWU. The Agreement between Royal Mail Group and the Communication Workers Union Regarding Guiding Principles of Employment Security and a Mutual Interest Approach to Future Challenges and Opportunities.

4 June 2019 the DGSP met with management and instigated the nationally binding agreement in respect of a national disagreement re-announcement of the future strategy by Royal Mail. The management subsequently apologised for not consulting the CWU!

[k979aaa]

Nothing has been gained in our time without sacrifice of wage or hardship or freedom in our time It is very easy to cave in and except this situation in the days of a well fair state. And yet we have profiteers from far off lands espousing the easy life and one of those is the CEO it is becoming abundantly clear they have fewer options as far as workers as regards to foreign workers as yet it will take time to see how it all pans out.

[GRS]

Quite interesting Lee that your collection guys couldn’t give you a clear answer on why there is likely to be IA. That is because like 99.9% of posties they don’t understand what this dispute is about. Virtually all you read on here is people’s own thoughts and interpretation of things. Chinese whispers are abundant and if you looked back at every thread on this dispute since it started there are probably thousands of things that people claim to know or have heard we will be doing under RM proposals. In fact if you glued it all together we will be working 25 hours a day, 8 days a week for free. This in my opinion is one of the CWU’s biggest problems and failings. They scaremongered from early on with loads of stories breaking one after the other that it became a bit like the Labour manifesto at the last election - slightly unbelievable and therefore people become confused. As I said earlier ask most posties why they’re striking and it comes down to “Rico Back is a big nasty man cos Terry told us he is”