Mandatory Facemasks

[jono481]

Been told this is happening in our MC from next Monday.
I am legitimately exempt from wearing any sort of face covering . Surely I cannot be FORCED to wear one ?

[paulus103]

Tell the Line manager before you start work and they will have to let you work without one.
You may have to produce something or explain the situation

[sameer1haq]

Yeah I believe all MCs have to on Monday. You have to provide evidence though that you are exempt and you’ll have to wear an I am exempt lanyard or whatever to show it, just make sure u show evidence :)

[SpacePhoenix]

You may have to produce something or explain the situation

You have to provide evidence though that you are exempt

It's illegal for them to do that (DDA regs), that's why it doesn't get enforced on public transport and other places.

What the government should have done in the first place would have been to have all exemptions certified by a GP, with a lanyard issued that can only be issued by a GP. Then the police could have fined people not wearing a mask and shops, public transport would have been able to enforce it

[Woody Guthrie]

It's not illegal to ask for evidence of exemption, that's absolute nonsense.
An exemption for wearing face masks is treated like any other reasonable adjustment in the workplace due to a medical condition or disability. There is an obligation on the employee to provide evidence.

We even do it with RM footwear.

[tabact]

Email confirming mandatory from Monday but the government website rules on masks lists the exemptions. Your reason for not wearing one could be very personal so you are not under any obligation to state the reason you aren't wearing one.

https://www.gov.uk/government/publicati ... e-your-own

The relevant section for exemptions is surprisingly vague and includes the following:

"If you have an age, health or disability reason for not wearing a face covering:

you do not routinely need to show any written evidence of this
you do not need show an exemption card

This means that you do not need to seek advice or request a letter from a medical professional about your reason for not wearing a face covering.

Carrying an exemption card or badge is a personal choice and is not required by law."

[modelmakes]

Hi everyone,

It is my first post in these forums but I read them with interest

Is anyone else concerned about Royal Mail staff not wearing mandatory face masks? At my MC Angard staff are checked upon entrance for face masks but as Royal Mail staff can let themselves in, this doesn't happen.

About 80% of Royal Mail staff are not wearing facemasks. I am happy to wear one and have been doing so for a month.

Having received Angard's email this morning does anyone know if Royal mail staff are being sent the same message as it really is quite frustrating to see their lack of compliance??

[tabact]

There's been no obligation for Angard staff to wear face masks at my MC. Talking to a RM manager last night it sounded like everybody in the MC would be expected to wear a mask from Monday.

[Woody Guthrie]

Email confirming mandatory from Monday but the government website rules on masks lists the exemptions. Your reason for not wearing one could be very personal so you are not under any obligation to state the reason you aren't wearing one.

https://www.gov.uk/government/publicati ... e-your-own

The relevant section for exemptions is surprisingly vague and includes the following:

"If you have an age, health or disability reason for not wearing a face covering:

you do not routinely need to show any written evidence of this
you do not need show an exemption card

This means that you do not need to seek advice or request a letter from a medical professional about your reason for not wearing a face covering.

Carrying an exemption card or badge is a personal choice and is not required by law."

This applies to everyday use of face masks, entering shops and businesses.
It has nothing to do with mandatory face masks in the workplace.
Workplaces are governed by the Health and Safety at Work Act which places an obligation on the employer to provide a safe working environment for all employees.

The relevant legislation on exemption is this..

(Statute) The Health Protection (Coronavirus, Wearing of Face Coverings in a Relevant Place) (England) Regulations 2020, Section 4. Reasonable excuse (1) (a), (i) and (ii) https://www.legislation.gov.uk/uksi/202 ... 791_en.pdf" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Reasonable excuse 4.—(1) For the purposes of regulation 3(1), the circumstances in which a person (“P”) has a reasonable excuse include those where— (a) P cannot put on, wear or remove a face covering— (i) because of any physical or mental illness or impairment, or disability (within the meaning of ** section 6 of the Equality Act 2010(a)**), or (ii) without severe distress; (supporting anxiety)

Any employer is only compelled to make adjustments under the Equality Act if they are presented with the full facts of the disability.

That can take the form of a medical assessment or something called a Self Declaration but in both cases the reason for the request for adjustments has to be stated.

[tabact]

Any employer is only compelled to make adjustments under the Equality Act if they are presented with the full facts of the disability.

That can take the form of a medical assessment or something called a Self Declaration but in both cases the reason for the request for adjustments has to be stated.

Mandatory Facemasks

I take your point. The employer can ask and an employee can reply it is down to personal reasons that would cause them mental distress. The employer wouldn't be able to ask for specific details of the cause of the mental distress. I suppose an employer would then have to get the employee to sign a self declaration and weigh up the issues of letting a member of staff not wear a mask against protecting the rest of the workplace.

[wandle]

Email confirming mandatory from Monday but the government website rules on masks lists the exemptions. Your reason for not wearing one could be very personal so you are not under any obligation to state the reason you aren't wearing one.

https://www.gov.uk/government/publicati ... e-your-own

The relevant section for exemptions is surprisingly vague and includes the following:

"If you have an age, health or disability reason for not wearing a face covering:

you do not routinely need to show any written evidence of this
you do not need show an exemption card

This means that you do not need to seek advice or request a letter from a medical professional about your reason for not wearing a face covering.

Carrying an exemption card or badge is a personal choice and is not required by law."

This applies to everyday use of face masks, entering shops and businesses.
It has nothing to do with mandatory face masks in the workplace.
Workplaces are governed by the Health and Safety at Work Act which places an obligation on the employer to provide a safe working environment for all employees.

The relevant legislation on exemption is this..

(Statute) The Health Protection (Coronavirus, Wearing of Face Coverings in a Relevant Place) (England) Regulations 2020, Section 4. Reasonable excuse (1) (a), (i) and (ii) https://www.legislation.gov.uk/uksi/202 ... 791_en.pdf" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Reasonable excuse 4.—(1) For the purposes of regulation 3(1), the circumstances in which a person (“P”) has a reasonable excuse include those where— (a) P cannot put on, wear or remove a face covering— (i) because of any physical or mental illness or impairment, or disability (within the meaning of ** section 6 of the Equality Act 2010(a)**), or (ii) without severe distress; (supporting anxiety)

Any employer is only compelled to make adjustments under the Equality Act if they are presented with the full facts of the disability.

That can take the form of a medical assessment or something called a Self Declaration but in both cases the reason for the request for adjustments has to be stated.

The list of relevant places does NOT include Royal Mail or a plethora of other businesses. Those regulations only apply to shops, shopping centres, banks, and Post Offices (which are of course owned by the government and no longer part of Royal Mail plc):


SCHEDULE Regulations2 and3
PART 1
Relevant places where face coverings must be worn

1.—(1) A shop, but does not include—
(a) restaurants with table service, including restaurants and dining rooms in hotels or
members’clubs,
(b) bars,includingbarsin hotelsormembers’clubs, (c) public houses.
(2) For thepurposesof(1), anarea withinor adjacenttoa shopwhereseatingortablesare made availablebythatbusinessfortheconsumptionoffoodanddrinkonthepremisesby customers of thatbusinessis notarelevantplaceforthepurposesoftheseRegulations.
2. Enclosed shopping centres, excluding any area in that building which is open to the public and where seatingortablesaremadeavailablefortheconsumptionoffoodanddrink.
3.Banks, building societies, credit unions, short-term loan providers, savings clubs and undertakings which by way of business operate a currency exchange office,transmit money(or any representation of money)byanymeansorcashchequeswhichare madepayabletocustomers.
4. Post Offices.

[tabact]

The list of relevant places does NOT include Royal Mail or a plethora of other businesses. Those regulations only apply to shops, shopping centres, banks, and Post Offices (which are of course owned by the government and no longer part of Royal Mail plc):

This is being introduced due to all the extra Christmas staff at mail centres and Royal Mail making sure they've covered themselves on health and safety grounds. It's reasonable to assume that they will follow government guidelines though not compulsory. Any business can introduce mandatory masks on h&s grounds if they care to, what will be interesting is what happens to anybody who claims an exemption. Will they be put on sick leave or unpaid leave? By introducing mandatory masks you can't allow one person without a mask to potentially infect dozens of fellow workers.

[Woody Guthrie]

what will be interesting is what happens to anybody who claims an exemption. Will they be put on sick leave or unpaid leave?

If they have a genuine medical condition or disability the business will have to attempt to make reasonable adjustments to their duty where possible.

They can't put them on sick leave or unpaid leave because that would be discrimination however as I've tried to explain in order to be protected in this way the employee has to provide evidence, you can't just say I can't wear a mask and expect the employer to accept and act on that.

If you refuse to wear a mask and when asked why you say I'm not telling you or it's none of your business I think you can expect to be asked to leave the premises on Health and Safety grounds.

To be honest if it's genuine i'm struggling to see why anyone wouldn't explain the situation and provide evidence where practical. It sounds to me more like people just don't want to wear a mask and are looking to use a rule that's designed to protect those with genuine issues as a get out ticket. Pretty low.

[wandle]

No matter what people THINK the law is, and what Royal Mail policy is, the law is quite clear:

“Face coverings are not classified as PPE (personal protective equipment) which is used in a limited number of settings to protect wearers against hazards and risks, such as surgical masks or respirators used in medical and industrial settings”

More relevantly, to those who think you need to provide written evidence, the law is again quite clear on this:


Exemption cards

If you have an age, health or disability reason for not wearing a face covering:

you do not routinely need to show any written evidence of this
you do not need show an exemption card
This means that you do not need to seek advice or request a letter from a medical professional about your reason for not wearing a face covering.

Some people may feel more comfortable showing something that says they do not have to wear a face covering. This could be in the form of an exemption card, badge or even a home-made sign”

That is the law, as updated on 5th November 2020

https://www.gov.uk/government/publicati ... 5-november" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

[TrueBlueTerrier]

No matter what people THINK the law is, and what Royal Mail policy is, the law is quite clear:

“Face coverings are not classified as PPE (personal protective equipment) which is used in a limited number of settings to protect wearers against hazards and risks, such as surgical masks or respirators used in medical and industrial settings”

More relevantly, to those who think you need to provide written evidence, the law is again quite clear on this:

Exemption cards

If you have an age, health or disability reason for not wearing a face covering:

you do not routinely need to show any written evidence of this
you do not need show an exemption card
This means that you do not need to seek advice or request a letter from a medical professional about your reason for not wearing a face covering.

Some people may feel more comfortable showing something that says they do not have to wear a face covering. This could be in the form of an exemption card, badge or even a home-made sign”

But, as far as I understand none of this stops Royal Mail asking for evidence, and none of it means you shouldn't provide evidence. In fact all it says is you do not routinely need to provide evidence. Providing evidence only when when initially asked to do so is not "routinely".

In essence its a badly written piece of legislation and both sides of the argument have a viable position, would you be willing to refuse to show evidence, or to insist that someone shows evidence, even if both are done with good intentions.


---------vvvvv-------------------- Not aimed at anyone in particular----------vvvvv-----------

I will however add one thing. If you think COVID is not real and you are trying to use this to get out of wearing a mask, then you are beyond redemption. Thinking only sheep will wear the mask and then attempting to force others in to accepting you not wearing a mask for a political point is just another form of repression.

Disagree with wearing the mask, even complain and air your position, but unless you have a medical reason not to do so then please wear a mask.