DBCBS not shown with initial illustration - poor show

Post by **stephen500** » 09 Sep 2020, 08:33

One thing which I think is wrong is that no real figures are given for your Defined cash balance scheme monies, until after you are comitted to taking your pension.
Yes I know you can work this out by looking at your 2019 illustration and seeing the 2018 DBCBS figure there and adding 2019, which appears to be about the same and for 2020/21 look at your pensionable contributional pay rate and times that by 52 (for weekly pay) and 12 (for monthly pay) and finding 19.6% of that amount, to give you, your cash balance figure for 2020/21.
But why should we have to do this.
Your DBCBS lump sum figure, should be given to you, at the illustration stage. I guess they don't want to have to do that, to reduce hassle with HR pay.
But the way they do it, they are forcing us to commit to the pension before getting sight of our DBCBS.

heapsy · Post by **heapsy** » 09 Sep 2020, 20:27

We should by now be able to get a rough idea of our pensions online. Cannot understand why RM can't, or wont do this.

Post by **stephen500** » 10 Sep 2020, 08:14

heapsy wrote:We should by now be able to get a rough idea of our pensions online. Cannot understand why RM can't, or wont do this.

Also for the Defined benefit cash balance scheme, it is not until you claim your pension, that they tell you that what is known as your excess DBCBS monies, which is your DBCBS pot that is over and above your tax free amount, that only 25% of that is tax free and 75% is taxable at your tax rate. (if you choose option 2A for NRA 65) So for nearly £7800 I will pay about £1170 in tax.

Hawkey99 · Post by **Hawkey99** » 16 Sep 2020, 20:36

Surely these are issues that the CWU pension trustees should be challenging ??

Hawkey99 · Post by **Hawkey99** » 26 Sep 2020, 16:50

Roughly how do you work out your current DBCBS amount.

I know we had last years so and we have our wages slips this year.

Is it last years plus the amount on your ways slip and then times that amount by 3 (roughly)

Or is there a better way ??

Post by **RobertT** » 26 Sep 2020, 17:03

A. Take the amount on the 2019 illustration and add 3.7%.

B. We haven't had a pay rise since April 2019, so take the number of weeks you've paid in since then and do the following:

Divide weekly amount by 6 and then multiply by 19.6% then multiply by number of weeks. For example:

23.87 / 6 = 3.97 x 19.6 = 77.97 x 76 = 5,926

A + B = total DBCBS to date

EDIT: A small schoolboy error on my part.

Although we haven't had a pay rise since April 2019, our pension contributions did of course go up by 2.4% in April 2020, due to changes introduced in 2014.

Hawkey99 · Post by **Hawkey99** » 26 Sep 2020, 18:43

Thanks Robert.

Out of interest what does the 6 represent ?

Post by **RobertT** » 26 Sep 2020, 19:12

It's the employee contribution in percentage terms.

Dividing your weekly contribution by 6 gives 1% and then multiplying by 19.6 gives the total weekly contributions, including RM's 13.6%.

Post by **stephen500** » 26 Sep 2020, 21:37

RobertT wrote:A. Take the amount on the 2019 illustration and add 3.7%.

B. We haven't had a pay rise since April 2019, so take the number of weeks you've paid in since then and do the following:

Divide weekly amount by 6 and then multiply by 19.6% then multiply by number of weeks. For example:

23.87 / 6 = 3.97 x 19.6 = 77.97 x 76 = 5,926

A + B = total DBCBS to date

Or another way to do it, is to take the pension contrib pay in the top right hand corner of your wage slip (below office code) and find 19.6% of that and times that by the amount of weeks.
So either Robert T' method works £34.77 /6 x 19.6 = £113.58 x 52 = £5906 or my method works £579.54 pension contrib pay x 19.6% = £113.58 x 52 = £5906 or to find part of year divide by 52 and times by part weeks of the year.
Remember your pensions contrib pay reflects whether you are paid weekly or monthly and if you are manager you have to times it by 12 to get a yearly DBCBS amount.
At the end of the day, both Robert T's and my methods both work.

Post by **freespeech** » 26 Sep 2020, 22:56

stephen500 wrote:
RobertT wrote:A. Take the amount on the 2019 illustration and add 3.7%.

B. We haven't had a pay rise since April 2019, so take the number of weeks you've paid in since then and do the following:

Divide weekly amount by 6 and then multiply by 19.6% then multiply by number of weeks. For example:

23.87 / 6 = 3.97 x 19.6 = 77.97 x 76 = 5,926

A + B = total DBCBS to date
Or another way to do it, is to take the pension contrib pay in the top right hand corner of your wage slip (below office code) and find 19.6% of that and times that by the amount of weeks.
So either Robert T' method works £34.77 /6 x 19.6 = £113.58 x 52 = £5906 or my method works £579.54 pension contrib pay x 19.6% = £113.58 x 52 = £5906 or to find part of year divide by 52 and times by part weeks of the year.
Remember your pensions contrib pay reflects whether you are paid weekly or monthly and if you are manager you have to times it by 12 to get a yearly DBCBS amount.
At the end of the day, both Robert T's and my methods both work.

The only thing I would add is that you may also want to consider the position over the year. I've had different pension contrib pay changes a couple of times of year at times and you need to effectively average these depending on how long they were applicable for.

Post by **stephen500** » 27 Sep 2020, 09:26

freespeech wrote:
stephen500 wrote:
RobertT wrote:A. Take the amount on the 2019 illustration and add 3.7%.

B. We haven't had a pay rise since April 2019, so take the number of weeks you've paid in since then and do the following:

Divide weekly amount by 6 and then multiply by 19.6% then multiply by number of weeks. For example:

23.87 / 6 = 3.97 x 19.6 = 77.97 x 76 = 5,926

A + B = total DBCBS to date
Or another way to do it, is to take the pension contrib pay in the top right hand corner of your wage slip (below office code) and find 19.6% of that and times that by the amount of weeks.
So either Robert T' method works £34.77 /6 x 19.6 = £113.58 x 52 = £5906 or my method works £579.54 pension contrib pay x 19.6% = £113.58 x 52 = £5906 or to find part of year divide by 52 and times by part weeks of the year.
Remember your pensions contrib pay reflects whether you are paid weekly or monthly and if you are manager you have to times it by 12 to get a yearly DBCBS amount.
At the end of the day, both Robert T's and my methods both work.
The only thing I would add is that you may also want to consider the position over the year. I've had different pension contrib pay changes a couple of times of year at times and you need to effectively average these depending on how long they were applicable for.

True, but for me, mine has never changed, barring a pay increase we had.