Legacy payments sacrifical lamb?

[stephen500]

Having looked at RM pay proposals presented at the national briefing, I just hope that our union is not prepared to sacrifice our legacy payments to acheive it's pension aim. Sacrificing one group of workers to improve the lot of others is not what our union should be about. Ex PHGs stand to lose £20 (PHG), £10 PBS and for those on nights around £12 in night allowance. A wacking £42 per week or £2000 per annum. On top of that we stand to lose up to £5000 per annum in pensionable allowances. Even if we had a 2.5% pay rise for 3 years, it would only be in the third year, that we would get back to where we would be in 2017 with those cuts.
In 2000 under the way forward, ex PHGs had to wait for about 4 years before we got a pay rise, whilst postman's pay caught up. Don't sell us out.

[Duran]

I dont think Terry cares about any legacy or allowance payments. He's blinkered with just trying to get a pension for all.At serious cost to all our gross pay. how can reducing gross pay to achieve a crap pension be beneficial to the members.

[jetblack]

I dont think Terry cares about any legacy or allowance payments. He's blinkered with just trying to get a pension for all.At serious cost to all our gross pay. how can reducing gross pay to achieve a crap pension be beneficial to the members.

Sources ??

[Duran]

....

[Duran]

I dont think Terry cares about any legacy or allowance payments. He's blinkered with just trying to get a pension for all.At serious cost to all our gross pay. how can reducing gross pay to achieve a crap pension be beneficial to the members.

Sources ??

http://www.royalmailchat.co.uk/communit ... 27&t=78063" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

[Duran]

Way forward agreement. States and I quote "Retained Indefinately". If the CWU agree to sign away our Protected rights. We should all seek legal action against the CWU for compensation. I for one do not Authorise the CWU to agree to negotiate away my Reserved Rights of the last 17 years.

we need Clarification from the CWU . That in no uncertain terms will protected pensionable pay for Ex PHG's Cashco or Drivers. Be used as a bargaining chip, towards pay or pension deal.

[fishtank]

You do authorise the CWU to negotiate on your behalf. That's pretty much the definition of collective bargaining. You can't on an individual basis pick and choose which terms and conditions it negotiates. In 2010 I, along with most of the guys on delivery lost my Early Shift allowance which had been "retained indefinitely". We have over the years lost other allowances in the name of pay simplification. Legally the position is simple, If you hand over the power to negotiate your T&Cs to a third party on a collective basis and those changes are accepted by the collective using a legitimate democratic process then the changes are lawful.

At the end of the day you could always rock up to Moya's office and try to negotiate your own terms and conditions.

[Duran]

You do authorise the CWU to negotiate on your behalf. That's pretty much the definition of collective bargaining. You can't on an individual basis pick and choose which terms and conditions it negotiates. In 2010 I, along with most of the guys on delivery lost my Early Shift allowance which had been "retained indefinitely". We have over the years lost other allowances in the name of pay simplification. Legally the position is simple, If you hand over the power to negotiate your T&Cs to a third party on a collective basis and those changes are accepted by the collective using a legitimate democratic process then the changes are lawful.

At the end of the day you could always rock up to Moya's office and try to negotiate your own terms and conditions.

That maybe you take on things. Lie down and accept it. I think there will be a bigger movement when it comes to stripping all pensionable allowances in favour of a slightly better pension, that royal mail are currently offering.More people will be involved in this if all these pensionable allowances are up for the chop. ( tpm. coaching payment. night allowance. driving pay. all legacy payments.).
This could be the first time since I started at Royal Mail. The negoiations will involve a pay cut on Gross pay. Nevermind pensionable allowances.

[jetblack]

I dont think Terry cares about any legacy or allowance payments. He's blinkered with just trying to get a pension for all.At serious cost to all our gross pay. how can reducing gross pay to achieve a crap pension be beneficial to the members.

Sources ??

http://www.royalmailchat.co.uk/communit ... 27&t=78063" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Yes - more than anything it was the reference to the "crap pension" that I was a bit perplexed about. The CWU proposal is far from a crap pension - it is a groundbreaking proposal in an era of low interest rates and DB schemes being pulled left right and centre. Its a proposal that means that our members won't be working towards a future of poverty in old age.

A worker in their twenties today will be circa £7k per year worse off in retirement under the RM proposal of a DC scheme for all.

[Duran]

I dont think Terry cares about any legacy or allowance payments. He's blinkered with just trying to get a pension for all.At serious cost to all our gross pay. how can reducing gross pay to achieve a crap pension be beneficial to the members.

Sources ??

http://www.royalmailchat.co.uk/communit ... 27&t=78063" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Yes - more than anything it was the reference to the "crap pension" that I was a bit perplexed about. The CWU proposal is far from a crap pension - it is a groundbreaking proposal in an era of low interest rates and DB schemes being pulled left right and centre. Its a proposal that means that our members won't be working towards a future of poverty in old age.

A worker in their twenties today will be circa £7k per year worse off in retirement under the RM proposal of a DC scheme for all.

Maybe I worded it wrong. Anything worse than our current pension. Losing allowances to pay for a pension inferior to what we have don't make sense. Surely better to keep allowances for higher gross pay and use it to fund AVC's for retirement.

[TrueBlueTerrier]

the chop. ( tpm. coaching payment. night allowance. driving pay. all legacy payments.).
This could be the first time since I started at Royal Mail. The negotiations will involve a pay cut on Gross pay. Nevermind pensionable allowances.

No it isn't. If you get legacy payments then you must have been in Royal Mail when we in Deliveries lost Early Shift payments and D2D payments, that was a big cut in gross pay for us. Mail centres were barely affected.

Bt2010 was no friend of walking posties. Before you accuse me of not fighting it, I was on strike against it, I posted on here about a bad deal I thought it was and I even wrote pieces for the local press decrying it. Yet it still got voted in, that's the drawback of collective bargaining sometimes what you disagree with gets voted in.

Will I fight this proposal yes, but don't turn on your colleagues and accuse them of cowardice or rolling over, especially when they are up for a fight even if they lost a lot their own allowances previously.

[Duran]

Terrier. You really are a piece of work. I have never accused a colleague of Cowardice. Don't be putting your type into my words ! Maybe if you stopped running this board like a keyboard warrior more would stay and post here.

[TrueBlueTerrier]

That maybe you take on things. Lie down and accept it. I

I didn't accuse you of calling people cowards. I offered advice and information after you posted the above. If you take offence at how I use words then I can only apologise as no offence was meant, but I would ask you too, likewise, be more careful in your choices.

[SpacePhoenix]

the chop. ( tpm. coaching payment. night allowance. driving pay. all legacy payments.).
This could be the first time since I started at Royal Mail. The negotiations will involve a pay cut on Gross pay. Nevermind pensionable allowances.

No it isn't. If you get legacy payments then you must have been in Royal Mail when we in Deliveries lost Early Shift payments and D2D payments, that was a big cut in gross pay for us. Mail centres were barely affected.

Bt2010 was no friend of walking posties. Before you accuse me of not fighting it, I was on strike against it, I posted on here about a bad deal I thought it was and I even wrote pieces for the local press decrying it. Yet it still got voted in, that's the drawback of collective bargaining sometimes what you disagree with gets voted in.

Will I fight this proposal yes, but don't turn on your colleagues and accuse them of cowardice or rolling over, especially when they are up for a fight even if they lost a lot their own allowances previously.

Any agreement no matter how good or bad is always voted in or out by DO staff as DO staff outnumber all other staff by at least 2:1

[Tman]

. ( tpm. coaching payment. night allowance. driving pay. all legacy payments.).
.

The TPM allowance has looked dodgy for years, ever since Ops area managers (in MC's) utilized the TPM hours allocation for additional processing time. Then again, most so-called TPM trained operators saw it as nothing more than "money for nothing" and did no more than the other non-TPM trained staff.
Piss-poor management yet again.