Equalization of the terms of the new contract and the old one

[clashcityrocker]

There is an enormous difference between the workload then and the workload now.
Being bounced between 2 hour 30 duties and being bounced between 4 hour duties with double/triple mail really isn't comparable.

And most of us received decent training.

[Woody84]

Don't know about other offices, but these new contracts like someone said get paid a better overtime rate I believe, hardly any learn different walks, fail to work efficiently or lack of effort (mix of poor training and the individuals) , and none learn any sorting and just put their own jobs out before sorters have even finished. So it's not all unfair tbh, id say the only unfair thing from what I am seeing is the paid breaks tbh. Equal pay for equal workload, more experienced staff appear to be doing a hell of a lot more sorting before even touching the duties. Then most try to clear on top.

Any jobs going in your office? Sounds bliss for us newbies…

I’m bounced all over the shop as day off cover, double packets here there and every where and only ever had three days consecutively on a walk. I cover rurals, afternoons and help with sorting + LAT’s.

Yeah as most posties have had to do...then finally get their own round after learning stuff and putting the graft in. Basic

When you say ‘most posties’ I’m guessing you’re mainly referring to legacy posties… who are on £2 more an hour. Easy to say suck it up it happened to us back in the day, but things will never get better in terms of pay etc for newbies. “You’ll eventually get your own walk”… ah grand, thanks.

[Woody84]

Don't know about other offices, but these new contracts like someone said get paid a better overtime rate I believe, hardly any learn different walks, fail to work efficiently or lack of effort (mix of poor training and the individuals) , and none learn any sorting and just put their own jobs out before sorters have even finished. So it's not all unfair tbh, id say the only unfair thing from what I am seeing is the paid breaks tbh. Equal pay for equal workload, more experienced staff appear to be doing a hell of a lot more sorting before even touching the duties. Then most try to clear on top.

Any jobs going in your office? Sounds bliss for us newbies…

I’m bounced all over the shop as day off cover, double packets here there and every where and only ever had three days consecutively on a walk. I cover rurals, afternoons and help with sorting + LAT’s.

Yeah as most posties have had to do...then finally get their own round after learning stuff and putting the graft in. Basic

Seniority on rounds is there for a reason

everyone is a spare to start with

Learn them and wait your turn for a duty to become free

I was a spare man for my first 6 years

Today some new starters think they should have their own round from the off

For clarification- I’m not one of them.

But was answering the post above about newbies not willing to learn new walks etc. I’m flexible and completely understand and agree with seniority. But my gripe is mainly with the conditions newbies will be In for the entirety of our RM career. There shouldn’t be a two tier pay bracket, breaks, delivery supplements etc. Luckily I’m in an office where all legacy people agree it’s a farce.

But things need to improve for the business to continue, otherwise we’ll soon be another Amazon, yodel, Evri company with owner drivers and the like. I’m up for learning what ever I can for everyone, I like to think I’ve gained their respect from working my balls off. But that doesn’t mean that *one day* I don’t want what they’ve got and that’s not entirely to do with my own walk/seniority. There should be a pathway for new starts to receive the same pay if they’ve earned their stripes.

[Smoothbackground]

And the problem is — unlike a legacy postie — even if/when a new-entrant did get a fixed duty, that’d still only be part of their workload. As happens at our place, those lucky enough to do the same duty every day would still have to come back in the afternoon and go back out with both large and small tracked for a separate lapsed walk and any bundles of mail remaining for that lapsed walk.

[TooManyLoops]

Okay, because I think many people don’t quite understand what I mean.

The truth is, new staff have worse conditions, with the highest workload. Of course, there are drivers on old contracts and walkers who ride along with drivers – they do the same work as the new staff, but under better terms.

Then there’s another group, who also have better contracts, but take 30–50% fewer parcels and even finish an hour earlier. Where is the fairness in that?

The highest workload?

Who the hell gets to finish an hour early???? Not a chance at our DO, we all have the same finish time

In our depot, both drivers and some walkers are really overburdened. Many have already quit. For us, there’s never a lighter day – there’s always some walk with several days’ worth of letters waiting, or someone absent. The example is being told to clear letters on a Sunday.

For us? Who is "us"?

[TopperGas]

Don't know about other offices, but these new contracts like someone said get paid a better overtime rate I believe, hardly any learn different walks, fail to work efficiently or lack of effort (mix of poor training and the individuals) , and none learn any sorting and just put their own jobs out before sorters have even finished. So it's not all unfair tbh, id say the only unfair thing from what I am seeing is the paid breaks tbh. Equal pay for equal workload, more experienced staff appear to be doing a hell of a lot more sorting before even touching the duties. Then most try to clear on top.

Any jobs going in your office? Sounds bliss for us newbies…

I’m bounced all over the shop as day off cover, double packets here there and every where and only ever had three days consecutively on a walk. I cover rurals, afternoons and help with sorting + LAT’s.

Yeah as most posties have had to do...then finally get their own round after learning stuff and putting the graft in. Basic

Seniority on rounds is there for a reason

everyone is a spare to start with

Learn them and wait your turn for a duty to become free

I was a spare man for my first 6 years

Today some new starters think they should have their own round from the off

For clarification- I’m not one of them.

But was answering the post above about newbies not willing to learn new walks etc. I’m flexible and completely understand and agree with seniority. But my gripe is mainly with the conditions newbies will be In for the entirety of our RM career. There shouldn’t be a two tier pay bracket, breaks, delivery supplements etc. Luckily I’m in an office where all legacy people agree it’s a farce.

But things need to improve for the business to continue, otherwise we’ll soon be another Amazon, yodel, Evri company with owner drivers and the like. I’m up for learning what ever I can for everyone, I like to think I’ve gained their respect from working my balls off. But that doesn’t mean that *one day* I don’t want what they’ve got and that’s not entirely to do with my own walk/seniority. There should be a pathway for new starts to receive the same pay if they’ve earned their stripes.

I doubt anybody on the forum disagrees with that view but we have zero control over what the company decides to do in future.

Listening to the GoTo 30 presentation earlier and one of the first points raised were that RM are only making a tiny profit, in % terms, from £B turnover and that must improve, it's clearly not going to improve if they start equalising contracts upwards rather than downwards?

[Smoothbackground]

Who the hell gets to finish an hour early???? Not a chance at our DO, we all have the same finish time

That will undoubtedly be the case. But bet it doesn’t stop the usual culprits being back 40 minutes or more prior thereto. I counted 7 hours of potential labour stood idly by the SISO stand (the SISO PDA itself having been removed to stop early scanning out) waiting for clocking-out time on Friday just gone. New-contract posties are sent out with a single loop of lapsing in a far-flung corner of the patch even with that amount of time remaining, yet some legacy-contract posties are seemingly able to stand around/hide in vans on paid company time.

[scotchy1962]

And the problem is — unlike a legacy postie — even if/when a new-entrant did get a fixed duty, that’d still only be part of their workload. As happens at our place, those lucky enough to do the same duty every day would still have to come back in the afternoon and go back out with both large and small tracked for a separate lapsed walk and any bundles of mail remaining for that lapsed walk.

Struggling with this one Smooth, do you newbies not have a finishing time? Do you have compulsory o/t in your contract?
You are making it sound like the newbies are being overburdened by the company but the legacy posties are somehow to blame?
Maybe in my old age i am misunderstanding what exactly you are saying and i apologise in advance if i have.

[Peabrain22]

But when a run comes up for grabs because someone has left i think that person should be on the same pay as the person who has been doing it for a lifetime..

[TopperGas]

Who the hell gets to finish an hour early???? Not a chance at our DO, we all have the same finish time

That will undoubtedly be the case. But bet it doesn’t stop the usual culprits being back 40 minutes or more prior thereto. I counted 7 hours of potential labour stood idly by the SISO stand (the SISO PDA itself having been removed to stop early scanning out) waiting for clocking-out time on Friday just gone. New-contract posties are sent out with a single loop of lapsing in a far-flung corner of the patch even with that amount of time remaining, yet some legacy-contract posties are seemingly able to stand around/hide in vans on paid company time.

Have you raised the issue with the DO manager? What would happen if you said "no" when asked to do the additional work?

[TooManyLoops]

Who the hell gets to finish an hour early???? Not a chance at our DO, we all have the same finish time

That will undoubtedly be the case. But bet it doesn’t stop the usual culprits being back 40 minutes or more prior thereto. I counted 7 hours of potential labour stood idly by the SISO stand (the SISO PDA itself having been removed to stop early scanning out) waiting for clocking-out time on Friday just gone. New-contract posties are sent out with a single loop of lapsing in a far-flung corner of the patch even with that amount of time remaining, yet some legacy-contract posties are seemingly able to stand around/hide in vans on paid company time.

How do you know they are back 40 minutes or more?

And if you stood and counted the labour stood idly, what were you doing?

[Smoothbackground]

And the problem is — unlike a legacy postie — even if/when a new-entrant did get a fixed duty, that’d still only be part of their workload. As happens at our place, those lucky enough to do the same duty every day would still have to come back in the afternoon and go back out with both large and small tracked for a separate lapsed walk and any bundles of mail remaining for that lapsed walk.

Struggling with this one Smooth, do you newbies not have a finishing time? Do you have compulsory o/t in your contract?
You are making it sound like the newbies are being overburdened by the company but the legacy posties are somehow to blame?
Maybe in my old age i am misunderstanding what exactly you are saying and i apologise in advance if i have.

We do have a finish time. Overtime is by no means compulsory.

Let me try to give an example. Legacy Postie and New Postie come to work. Legacy Postie finds he has barely anything for his walk - 40-odd tracked, most of which are postable, tiny bundles of mail with perhaps a 20% call rate, no specials. He is rubbing his hands with glee. He knows he can call this a day’s work anyhow.

New Postie on the other hand comes in to a similar workload to Legacy Postie. Instead, he is told that as it is a light day he will be expected back from his walk for his afternoon parcels at 1.00 pm instead of 2.30 pm and will be given 40 more parcels than usual. As he is scanning and loading up his afternoon parcels, he is watching his legacy colleagues all standing idle when they should.

Need to be clear, this isn’t my complaint, but it is a big gripe of my new-entrant colleagues who do a “mid shift” (those whose walk is prepped for them, meaning they go straight out on delivery upon starting, meaning their whole working day is pretty much outdoor delivery).

[SkiSunday]

Who the hell gets to finish an hour early???? Not a chance at our DO, we all have the same finish time

That will undoubtedly be the case. But bet it doesn’t stop the usual culprits being back 40 minutes or more prior thereto. I counted 7 hours of potential labour stood idly by the SISO stand (the SISO PDA itself having been removed to stop early scanning out) waiting for clocking-out time on Friday just gone. New-contract posties are sent out with a single loop of lapsing in a far-flung corner of the patch even with that amount of time remaining, yet some legacy-contract posties are seemingly able to stand around/hide in vans on paid company time.

How do you know they are back 40 minutes or more?

And if you stood and counted the labour stood idly, what were you doing?

[scotchy1962]

And the problem is — unlike a legacy postie — even if/when a new-entrant did get a fixed duty, that’d still only be part of their workload. As happens at our place, those lucky enough to do the same duty every day would still have to come back in the afternoon and go back out with both large and small tracked for a separate lapsed walk and any bundles of mail remaining for that lapsed walk.

Struggling with this one Smooth, do you newbies not have a finishing time? Do you have compulsory o/t in your contract?
You are making it sound like the newbies are being overburdened by the company but the legacy posties are somehow to blame?
Maybe in my old age i am misunderstanding what exactly you are saying and i apologise in advance if i have.

We do have a finish time. Overtime is by no means compulsory.

Let me try to give an example. Legacy Postie and New Postie come to work. Legacy Postie finds he has barely anything for his walk - 40-odd tracked, most of which are postable, tiny bundles of mail with perhaps a 20% call rate, no specials. He is rubbing his hands with glee. He knows he can call this a day’s work anyhow.

New Postie on the other hand comes in to a similar workload to Legacy Postie. Instead, he is told that as it is a light day he will be expected back from his walk for his afternoon parcels at 1.00 pm instead of 2.30 pm and will be given 40 more parcels than usual. As he is scanning and loading up his afternoon parcels, he is watching his legacy colleagues all standing idle when they should.

Need to be clear, this isn’t my complaint, but it is a big gripe of my new-entrant colleagues who do a “mid shift” (those whose walk is prepped for them, meaning they go straight out on delivery upon starting, meaning their whole working day is pretty much outdoor delivery).

Ok so your gripe still isn't really with the legacy Postie, your gripe is how the two types are managed.
Therefore the problem surely lies squarely at the feet of the company management and not the legacy posties you are berating constantly.
I obviously have no idea where you work and what the circumstances are within your office, but surely the handy days have finished for everyone.

[Smoothbackground]

Who the hell gets to finish an hour early???? Not a chance at our DO, we all have the same finish time

That will undoubtedly be the case. But bet it doesn’t stop the usual culprits being back 40 minutes or more prior thereto. I counted 7 hours of potential labour stood idly by the SISO stand (the SISO PDA itself having been removed to stop early scanning out) waiting for clocking-out time on Friday just gone. New-contract posties are sent out with a single loop of lapsing in a far-flung corner of the patch even with that amount of time remaining, yet some legacy-contract posties are seemingly able to stand around/hide in vans on paid company time.

How do you know they are back 40 minutes or more?

And if you stood and counted the labour stood idly, what were you doing?

I was busy setting up the bullring for the afternoon parcel sort with said posties were physically getting in the way hence my doing some mental arithmetic.